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pulled the maverick brakes off my car today, getting ready to swap the KH brakes and my Pacific Thunder adj lower arms. the passenger side joints were all nice and tight , the driver lower was good, but the upper ball joint was wasted, just flopped around. maybe I just got a dud, but damn, 1700 miles is just shameful. and before anyone asks, I did not buy the bottom of the barrel arms, but the were made in Taiwan. bought a pair of Proforged ball joints as a replacement.
 

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At least it's an easy one.... I got about 300 miles on a press in wheel bearing on my daughter's '08 Camry. I'd be happy to trade you!
 

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There is a big difference between ball joints, but 1700 miles is not much. Those lowers have Moog K772 screw in ball joints in them that have been very good for me and my customers..not complaints. My only issue with the Moog screw in BJs happened a month or so ago when I ordered a bunch of them and 80% of them did not have the rubber boot so I called and was told that Moog started integrating the rubber boot into the BJ. Problem was that Moog did not integrate the boot into the K772s but they eliminated the boot by accident anyhow. My next shipment had boots for all the K772s.
 

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You say "maverick brakes" so what spindle and so maybe it was binding and over stressing it.
 

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Proforged is PPM I think. Pretty sure we’re talking about imported ball joints from a low cost manufacturer. Most of the older Moog numbers are made here in the US. Some of the later stuff is not and comes from Mexico. If you want higher quality stuff, Mevotech reverse engineers Moog items and sends the designs to specific manufactures who use Mevo’s tooling and steel to produce some pretty good parts. I worked for them for a couple of years.

ex-Global West GM
1991-1995
 

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1967 fastback Mustang 289 to hipo specs with fitech, 4r70w auto, Shelby drop.
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GT289, you are an awesome resource for the board! Your posts helped me get the perfect front coils for my stang. It’s after the fact, but glad I bought mevotech upper and lower arms
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Proforged is PPM I think. Pretty sure we’re talking about imported ball joints from a low cost manufacturer. Most of the older Moog numbers are made here in the US. Some of the later stuff is not and comes from Mexico. If you want higher quality stuff, Mevotech reverse engineers Moog items and sends the designs to specific manufactures who use Mevo’s tooling and steel to produce some pretty good parts. I worked for them for a couple of years.

ex-Global West GM
1991-1995
the last moog parts I went to buy, tie rods I think, were stamped made in china. here's who's ball joints I bought, same place your thinking of? I haven't read anything bad about them other than being made in Taiwan

 

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FWIW I've had pretty good luck with Mcquay Norris upper ball joints . They do have a relocated grease fitting for what ever reason ?
 

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pulled the maverick brakes off my car today, getting ready to swap the KH brakes and my Pacific Thunder adj lower arms. the passenger side joints were all nice and tight , the driver lower was good, but the upper ball joint was wasted, just flopped around. maybe I just got a dud, but damn, 1700 miles is just shameful. and before anyone asks, I did not buy the bottom of the barrel arms, but the were made in Taiwan. bought a pair of Proforged ball joints as a replacement.
How much "flopping" is involved? Ford spec is a maximum of 0.250". You read that right, it's a quarter inch of "flop".
 

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Did you happen to use Dorman UCA with riveted ball joint? I have those as well and they were damned tight and i was afraid the grease wouldn't get distributed well. Ive got about 1500 miles, greased a few times but might break it off the spindle and rotate them around to check.

Would like to see pics of your new LCA as well. i think those are the ones on my wish list.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
How much "flopping" is involved? Ford spec is a maximum of 0.250". You read that right, it's a quarter inch of "flop".
picture a paint stick in water
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Did you happen to use Dorman UCA with riveted ball joint? I have those as well and they were damned tight and i was afraid the grease wouldn't get distributed well. Ive got about 1500 miles, greased a few times but might break it off the spindle and rotate them around to check.

Would like to see pics of your new LCA as well. i think those are the ones on my wish list.
I bought them from NPD years ago, whatever the best repro they had at the time. it's just the drivers side, the passenger one is fine. and yes, riveted joints

here's the lowers I have
 

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I recently had a ball joint that was DOA. It didn't quite seem right but I installed it anyway. Took it in for an alignment and was told it was loose.
 

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.250 of flop? wow! That video of the BJ isn't as bad as I pictured. Is the BJ loose or does it feel like the tolerances are tight but it just moves around easily? That looks like a Dorman or similar UCA.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
.250 of flop? wow! That video of the BJ isn't as bad as I pictured. Is the BJ loose or does it feel like the tolerances are tight but it just moves around easily? That looks like a Dorman or similar UCA.
it's completely loose, I put absolutely no effort into moving it.
 

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We only used Moog replacement suspension parts at work. I never once had a problem with any of their products but its been awhile and who knows if the quality is still the same. I cannot tell you about any of the go-fast-high-tech upgraded suspensions parts and systems. Th Moogs should last 50,000 miles even if you never did grease them.

I have to look up the specs on a Mustang but on some vehicles play is allowed measured with the weight off of the ball joint. Ball joints are one of the number parts replaced by shops when they did not need to be. That is because with weight off of joint there could be play, But the joint is designed to take up that play with weight on it. It depends on the design of the ball joint. You need to make sure you are checking it according the the vehicle manufacturer instructions.

The Bureau of Automotive Repair made the shops start recording the amount of play when they replaced the joint. It does not mean they could not have falsified the reading but I think it was more of a training aid to make shops realize that some play on some vehicles did not mean the ball joint was out of specifications.

How you check for play depends on if the upper control arm carries the weight like a Mustang does. This is because the spring sits on top of the upper control arm. On other vehicles, the lower control arm carries the weight because the spring sit on top of the lower arm. So if you want to unload the weight off of the joint to check for play on one you lift the car by the lower control arm and on the other you lift the car by the body.

I have never heard of a ball joint failing in 1700 miles. That's ridiculous. You get what you pay for when it comes to automotive parts.


16 CCR § 3360.2
§ 3360.2. General Requirements.
All automotive repair dealers engaged in the sale and installation of ball joints shall be subject to the following requirements:
(a) Measurement of Wear or Looseness. Except as set forth in (e) and (f) of this section, any determination that a ball joint is worn or loose shall be made with an instrument specifically designed and manufactured for measurement of ball joint wear or looseness.
(b) Care and Use of Instrument. The instrument required by (a) of this section shall be used, calibrated, and maintained in accordance with the instructions issued by its manufacturer. The manufacturer shall be the original equipment manufacturer or a manufacturer who is generally known within the automotive repair industry as a supplier of such instruments.
(c) Accuracy of Measurement. The measurement of wear or looseness of a ball joint shall be stated in thousandths of an inch (.001) or in millimeters, whichever is appropriate to the vehicle and to the specifications of the original equipment manufacturer or of the replacement parts manufacturer.
(d) Invoice Requirements. If a ball joint is sold and installed, the degree of wear or looseness of the ball joint being replaced must be recorded on the customer's invoice in accordance with (c) of this section. The maximum allowable wear or looseness permitted by the original equipment manufacturer or by the replacement parts manufacturer must be stated.
(e) Measurement of Wear-Indicating Ball Joints. If a ball joint is equipped with an integral means of measuring wear or looseness, such measurement shall be made and reported in accordance with the manufacturer's directions.
(f) Adjustment of Mechanically Adjustable Ball Joints. A ball joint that has been manufactured with a means of manual adjustment to compensate for wear shall be adjusted in accordance with the instructions of the manufacturer.
Note: Authority cited: Sections 9882 and 9884.19, Business and Professions Code. Reference: Sections 9884.7 and 9884.19, Business and Professions Code.
HISTORY
1. New NOTE filed 2-22-83; effective thirtieth day thereafter (Register 83, No. 9).
This database is current through 2/21/20 Register 2020, No. 8
16 CCR § 3360.2, 16 CA ADC § 3360.2
 

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the last moog parts I went to buy, tie rods I think, were stamped made in china. here's who's ball joints I bought, same place your thinking of? I haven't read anything bad about them other than being made in Taiwan

Interesting on the Moog tie rods. I was not aware of that. They do have a "white" box program (and have had since the 90's).
I wonder if that's where they're sourcing from now.
Someone also mentioned BJ grease fitting locations. That brought back memories of buying 10-15 uppers and always getting
one or two with the different zerk locations. (one in the head, one in the plate.... and I can't recall the other variation)
Used to drive me nuts.

ex-Global West GM
1991-1995
 
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