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Discussion Starter #1
Can someone please help me with what these heads are ? I bought a used engine with these on it and I have been all over the internet trying to find out what they are. They both have 351 under the cover and one has 4c27 and the other is 1d15. I'm trying to find out if these have the bigger valves or are they just like a 289 head, they are on with ARP bolts so I feel like they were looked at when it was rebuilt. Thanks
 

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4C27- 1974 March 27
1D15- 1971 April 15


The '69/'70 351W heads are supposed to be the best.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
So is there anyway to tell if there any better without pulling them off ? Or finding out the head size ( cc's) I bought this engine for $700 with ? Hyper pistons, 351 heads, double roller chain, which I can see but for my 65 I need a different timing cover and dampner or all my pulleys won't work. Boy did I open a can of worms
 

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So is there anyway to tell if there any better without pulling them off ? Or finding out the head size ( cc's) I bought this engine for $700 with ? Hyper pistons, 351 heads, double roller chain, which I can see but for my 65 I need a different timing cover and dampner or all my pulleys won't work. Boy did I open a can of worms
As was said in your other post, There is nothing wrong with the timing cover on that engine. Simply add a timing pointer to the other side of the engine and use a 3 bolt balancer.
 

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The heads are DOOE casting #s and were the same from '70-74 1.84 intake valve and 1.54 exhaust around 60cc as cast. '69s had a different casting number but function wise were the same. No need to pull them.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I found a 3 bolt balancer on marketplace, the question is would anybody use a used balancer or is it something I should buy new ? Also looking in my NPD catalog trying to find the timing pointer you guys are talking about adding ? And THANKS again for the help, priceless
 

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Here is the pointer and no to the used balancer. New stock style ones are cheap. Huskinhano recommended one that he used and Pioneer makes a quality stock style that is inexpensive. I think it is a DA289 part number with the recessed lip to fit the early pulley that has a lip on it. Message me if you need more info
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-Mercury-timing-pointer-221-260-289-302-351W-Mustang-Falcon-Comet-Fairlane/201564479697?epid=658670317&hash=item2eee2de0d1:g:-kgAAOxyLN9SfDHP:sc:USPSFirstClass!98391!US!-1
 

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The 1969 351 Windsor heads had very small combustion chambers which created higher compression. A 1970+ 351W head would have lower compression. They all had the same size ports and valves as far as I know. Thus, those aren't bad heads, but there's nothing particularly exceptional about them either.

While it's possible to bolt 351W heads onto a 289/302, it does take some mod'ing. Therefore, it's very likely your engine is an early 1970s 351W. That's important to know because not all of the parts are interchangeable between the 289/302 and the 351W. The firing order is also different. So, are you sure you have a 289 with 351W heads? If so, the 351W heads will flow better than the 289 heads, but definitely check the casting numbers on the block. You need to know what you have.

Ditto the statement about used balancers. FYI, harmonic balancers are two pieces separated by a rubber insulator. That rubber insulator deteriorates when it gets old and can create a genuinely dangerous situation if the two pieces separate.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Klutch the block is a 74 302. Knowing what these heads are will I make better power then a stock 289 or the same or less ? I don't want to go through all of this for nothing. The cam is what I have heard as a RV cam and it has .400 lift. As you can tell I don't know much about putting parts together to build an engine and I'm very greatful for all the help !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

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Klutch the block is a 74 302. Knowing what these heads are will I make better power then a stock 289 or the same or less ? I don't want to go through all of this for nothing. The cam is what I have heard as a RV cam and it has .400 lift. As you can tell I don't know much about putting parts together to build an engine and I'm very greatful for all the help !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
OK. Yes, 351W heads breathe much better than the 289 heads. Better breathing means more power. It was a popular mod back in the 70s to put 351W heads on a 289 or 302. (Serious guys used 351 Cleveland heads to create a "Clevor", but that was more involved.)

Better breathing means more power, but it's all very dependent on the combination of parts. "RV cam" sounds a bit disconcerting. Surprising someone would go to the effort to put on 351W heads then stab in some random cam. Since a cam is the heart of engine performance, I would politely suggest you install a cam appropriate to your car before installing that engine. Tell us what trans and differential you're running and what you want the car to do and we can recommend a good cam. Now is the time to address this issue. You can certainly replace a cam with the engine installed in the car, but it's much more involved.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Klutch I have a T-5 and I'm running a 3.40 gear out of a Mustang II. I have a 289 with a Weiland intake and a edelbrock 500 carb. I just want more power, I think I have maybe 165 HP and I'd like to have about 225-230. Some people have said to put on a set of edelbrock heads and a cam, what are your thoughts
 

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Klutch I have a T-5 and I'm running a 3.40 gear out of a Mustang II. I have a 289 with a Weiland intake and a edelbrock 500 carb. I just want more power, I think I have maybe 165 HP and I'd like to have about 225-230. Some people have said to put on a set of edelbrock heads and a cam, what are your thoughts
My thoughts would focus mostly on budget. If you have the budget for aluminum heads, to include new rockers, pushrods, cam and lifters, sure; go for it.

Or, with the right cam, headers, dual exhaust and calibrated distributor, you can make pretty good power with the 289 & 351W heads combo. 230 HP is certainly doable. You would have to install different rocker arms and screw-in, adjustable rocker studs for a lumpier cam. Of course, then you're getting into more money which may tilt you toward the aluminum heads option.

So, if it was my car and I had that engine, I would:

- Leave the heads as they are
- Install an Edelbrock Performer+ cam or something similar (compatible with factory rocker arms)
- The Weiand intake is fine, Or you can try an Edelbrock Air Gap intake
- Have the distributor calibrated to match the cam
- Install a good set of headers
- Install a nice, custom dual exhaust
- The 500 CFM carburetor is fine

The 3.40 rear gear will work fine, but since you have an overdrive, I would swap in a 3.90 for more pep. Dollars to doughnuts, you'd be pretty happy with that combination. And it will get you on the road and running nicely. Eventually, you can save enough coin for aluminum heads or another engine altogether. Nothing wrong with Edelbrock heads, but you'd likely be happier with Trick Flow or some of the other options.
 

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Looking at the pics it doesn't appear to have the correct head bolt spacers that are needed to bolt on 351w heads to a 302/289...... The 351w used bigger head bolts than the 302/289.
This is why I would not buy a used engine because you can't verify what the seller claims and it's hard to verify if said seller knows his a$$ from a hole in the ground.
 

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I'd also pull the heads off and put on some decent head gaskets while the engine is out of the car just as precaution.... so much easier. As said above, who knows what's been done. You could get the motor fired up and it starts overheating due to the head gasket being on backwards.... it'll only cost you $50.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
I found out I'm dealing with a real GENTLEMEN, when I told him I didn't feel good about the engine and heads he said no problem. He's going to come and get it and give me my money back. I told him to keep a little for his time and I will chalk it up to I leaned a lot. Like I said a real gentlemen . I'd like to thank everyone for all the help and input, Like I said I have learned a lot. THANKS again
 

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?

Rm, you don't want it ? Whats the issue ? There is NOTHING wrong with having 351W heads on a 302. It sounds like its got lots of good stuff in there. It has the ARP head bolts, so it would seem he didn't skimp on parts, whats up ? LSG
 

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Back before they sold alloy Ford heads everywhere, early 351W heads were quite sought after as being the best stock heads you could have until GT40's came out. To this day they still have their good points. With proper ARP adapter head bolts there's no "spacer" to see. I have two pair of exactly such heads that are NOT for sale. One set is ported and about prepped for use on a lightly modified '69 351W and the others I expect to use on a 1980's 5.0 (302). WITH ARP's good adapter bolts.
 
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