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Discussion Starter #222
Ok, an update at last! Spent a number of hours working on the forks for the front loader on my tractor. What does that have to do with my Mustang? Let me tell the story.
My brother borrowed the brush/pallet forks to use on his tractor. The forks were built for my 33 HP tractor, his is somewhere about 70 HP. Which means his tractor over powered them, breaking them. Sooooo....I had to get my stick welder, plasma cutter, grinder etc out to repair them because hopefully I will be needing them next week when I get a delivery.
Engine has been ordered, new Gen 3 Coyote crate motor on the way! Spreading the costs out over a few months...alternator, headers, starter, AC compressor, power steering, control pack, transmission and all the stuff that goes with transmission. So it is bare motor but soon I will be test fitting.
 

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Ok, an update at last! Spent a number of hours working on the forks for the front loader on my tractor. What does that have to do with my Mustang? Let me tell the story.
My brother borrowed the brush/pallet forks to use on his tractor. The forks were built for my 33 HP tractor, his is somewhere about 70 HP. Which means his tractor over powered them, breaking them. Sooooo....I had to get my stick welder, plasma cutter, grinder etc out to repair them because hopefully I will be needing them next week when I get a delivery.
Engine has been ordered, new Gen 3 Coyote crate motor on the way! Spreading the costs out over a few months...alternator, headers, starter, AC compressor, power steering, control pack, transmission and all the stuff that goes with transmission. So it is bare motor but soon I will be test fitting.
Awesome! Sounds like you will be on the road soon. I do have to ask though....I would have thought you would have already gotten the test fitting out of the way(at least with a junk block)? I guess its not critical without shock towers prior to epoxy primer though(much more room to play with)
 
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Discussion Starter #224
Believe me, the thought had crossed my mind and I looked around for a junk engine. I did a LOT of measurements and I don't believe the engine itself will be an issue, might have to make a few concessions for accessories though. I am sure that a remote oil filter is in the works. And of course, headers might be fight.
 

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Believe me, the thought had crossed my mind and I looked around for a junk engine. I did a LOT of measurements and I don't believe the engine itself will be an issue, might have to make a few concessions for accessories though. I am sure that a remote oil filter is in the works. And of course, headers might be fight.
I was very fortunate and found a low mileage 2017 GT at auction that had a junk title status, so it sold cheap. One of the best reasons to buy a complete engine is to get the accessory drive, alternator, AC compressor, etc. Those items add up fast when dressing out a crate engine.
Making measurements before installing the engine often end up just being an indicator, not a guarantee. I found that I had to notch the back of the subframe cross beam to get the oil pan to clear. This was a surprise as Total Control Products said the engine would fit with the stock oil pan. Later, I noted how close the alternator was to the DS frame rail. I determined the alternator could not be removed from the engine without lifting the engine from its mounts. As a maintenance consideration, I also notched the DS frame rail so that the alternator can be removed/replaced without having to lift the engine. Although not necessary, you can imagine the cussing I or the next owner of the car would be doing should the alternator fail. Then there is the firewall and transmission tunnel mods that were also part of the engine/transmission fitment.
I did not find a simple oil filter relocation bracket that would clear the PS rack, so I had to go with the remote filter approach. This also led to selecting a radiator with a built in oil cooler. I figured Ford put a oil cooler on for a reason, so better to cool the oil and not ask for problems down the road.
Until the engine is fully dressed with accessories and installed in the car, you won't know for sure. Just part of the process when building a restomod with this level of change.
I believe I have mentioned before that I worked with Ultimate Headers. Though not cheap, their 471071 headers fit well, however I did find I needed to add an intermediate bearing and another U-joint to snake the steering shaft around them. I believe the 471071 headers were installed on a customer car with the 3rd Gen Coyote. A call to Jim at Ultimate Headers would be worth the time to see if they have made any other product changes.
Good luck, looking forward to seeing your new Coyote installed.
 

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Believe me, the thought had crossed my mind and I looked around for a junk engine. I did a LOT of measurements and I don't believe the engine itself will be an issue, might have to make a few concessions for accessories though. I am sure that a remote oil filter is in the works. And of course, headers might be fight.
I had to go with a remote filter relocation kit as well(modified the stock housing base by cutting it down and tapping for the remote lines....the problem with using black-sheep motors is there is no aftermarket for little things like that...or much of anything, have to make pretty much everything). If I were you though, my main concern would be trans fitment. I know you aren't using the MT82 like me...but the T56 is still significantly larger than a T4 or T5, My main problem is that because I retained the stock rear-steer, front sump setup, the drag link dictated engine height, so unlike a rear sump, front-steer setup I couldn't drop the engine to make more room and my tunnel mods became....extreme:

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Discussion Starter #227
Well, big truck pulled up outside and I put my little tractor to work! Pictures little blurry, I was sweating like crazy and lens was moist.
Now gotta get the rest of stuff in AND figure out my lift points.
 

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I am using a set of the Coyote lift brackets from TDMotion. They are easy to install and work well.

 

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Man, those look like Gen 3 GT40P headers....
 
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Discussion Starter #230
One of the size constraints on fitting the motor in will be the way they have an oil cooler and filter stuck out at an angle where it will be VERY close to frame rail. Did a bit of research and found out most people just use an adapter and remove the cooler. It may not really be that beneficial as it uses hot coolant to cool hot oil. It originated because of Ford using oil spray on the pistons, getting the oil really hot, and on tough use vehicles such as the Police Interceptors AND the F150 Coyote.
For the F150 Coyote, they used a right angle adapter to angle the assembly forward for easier access. Soooo....although I have an adapter on the way to eliminate the cooler, I may look around for the right angle adapter or end up using a real, radiator type remote oil cooler.
20200715_144045.jpg
Ford-Coyote-truck-engine-front-mounted-oil-cooler-filter-mount.jpg
Ford-F-150-Coyote-engine-Oil Cooler.jpg
 

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I used a radiator from C&R that includes integral PS and engine oil coolers. So you get a "real" oil cooler going this route.



I have seen a 90 degree adapter that angles the oil filter forward, sort of like one of the pictures you posted but without the cooler. I tried replacing the oil cooler with a fitting that allows the oil filter to fit directly to the engine, however the PS rack gets in the way, so a remote oil filter appeared necessary. When I found the C&R radiator, I went that route. I am using the 6R80 AT and it requires its own oil cooler too. So to not have a stack of independent coolers on the front of the radiator, I chose the integrated approach. Not cheap, I think I paid $1700 to Summit Racing, but also got in on one of their $100 off $1000 spent. There was a supplier that had them for $1500, so bargains could still be out there.
 

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Discussion Starter #232
Ok, lets talk about headers. Sometime back I posted a picture of some factory headers that I had picked up at a good price that might be my fallback items. Really been planning on a set of Ultimate Headers, supposed to flow good, fit good, BUT $1,200-1,500 so pretty pricey.
I was doing some heavy research and found several mentions of how well the factory headers I bought really flowed, Ford used them on their 500+HP Aluminator engines. Incidentally, the crate motor comes with the right hand side included. So I bolted the left hand side on and did some measuring, outside flange on one header to the outside of the other was a little over 28 inches, way too wide to fit.
The first picture below shows how the wide section of the oval flange sticks out. So I spent about an hour slowly grinding the weld out to get the flange off that one side. Once I reclocked the flange I had it down to 26 3/4 inches, with some minor grinding on each side I can have it down to 26 1/2. OR, I could weld on extensions to drop the flange down below the frame rail and have it down to about 26 inches. Either way, I will have to set up to do some stainless welding.
This still won't guarantee they will work, I won't know until I actually try setting it into place. I might still have to dimple the sides a little bit. I might be giving up 10 horses or so but saving $1,000+ on the build.
 

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Saving a $1000 bucks is always a good thing. Glad to see you were able to reclock the flange to gain room.

For reference, here are a few drawings of the 471071 Ultimate Headers for reference showing how tightly they fit to the block.

762686
762687
762688

Here is a pic with of the DS header installed.



I also used their low profile clamps with O2 bungs. I had the clamps welded on to the collector on my set to provide the O2 bung and provide some adjustability in alignment. I still need to add an additional section to bring the outlet parallel to the floor.


More work to do, but exhaust is far down on my list for now.
 

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Discussion Starter #234
Saving a $1000 bucks is always a good thing. Glad to see you were able to reclock the flange to gain room.

For reference, here are a few drawings of the 471071 Ultimate Headers for reference showing how tightly they fit to the block.

View attachment 762686 View attachment 762687 View attachment 762688
Here is a pic with of the DS header installed.



I also used their low profile clamps with O2 bungs. I had the clamps welded on to the collector on my set to provide the O2 bung and provide some adjustability in alignment. I still need to add an additional section to bring the outlet parallel to the floor.


More work to do, but exhaust is far down on my list for now.
Those measurements definitely show I would get a little more room, and it could be in the end, I will have to take that route. Might depend on how the motor sets down in the K member.
 

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As far as the oil cooler goes...you can always get a remote oil cooler setup w/ thermostat, you are essentially just changing it from water-cooled to air-cooled...as to which works better, I would say they are about the same....the only difference being water-cooled would not require its own t-stat since it would already be using the cooling system one.

P.S. If you wanted to, you would likely be able to just use a filter relocation kit and re-use the water cooler, pretty sure most of them mount anywhere a filter normally mounts, I know the ones from various SRT-4 engines I used over the years did(you could probably even use a SRT4 cooler paired with a Viper filter if you got desperate to keep some OEM water cooler)
 
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