Vintage Mustang Forums banner

1 - 20 of 25 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
975 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
It has been a long time since I raised this question and I'd like to start a new thread on the topic of fan shrouds. Specifically, did the fan shroud appear beginning with BB's in 1967 and if so, were the first shrouds fiberglass? I have never seen an original c7 BB shroud... I have nothing, not even a picture, to use as a reference.
The last time we discussed this topic, I believe the census was that no one was reproducing a decent BB fan shroud that looked and fit like the original. Is this still true?

Thanks in advance for the help!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
687 Posts
Here is an expired e-bay auction with pics.
Link
The seller was JD Larson who is a poster here. This was a reproduction shroud, and it seems to be done correctly. He had a very limited supply. Most of the other reproductions are a smooth injection molded type, but there is an absolutely horrible hand laid fiberglass one available through some suppliers.( The originals looked more like the same material that the heater box is made of.)

I'm still trying to figure out if this was a standard part, or only came on cars equipped with AC.

Grab the pics for your archives. I have only seen 2 real shrouds come up for auction over the last 6 years. They both sold well above the price of this one. This was a one year only item and only for BB cars.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
134 Posts
My friend sold a mint used one several years ago on ebay, $11-$1200 range as I recall.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,832 Posts
In the case of Mustangs ,yes as 67 was the first year for BB but shrouds were used in other car lines prior. Originals were fiberglass with fiber (not sure it was horse hair), I've been told it was recycled linen. They were very brittle which is why you dont see many service pieces are some type of injection molded plastic. They fit fine but don't have the texture of original
 

·
(actually Slim Jr now)
Joined
·
24,597 Posts
tlea said:
In the case of Mustangs ,yes as 67 was the first year for BB but shrouds were used in other car lines prior. Originals were fiberglass with fiber (not sure it was horse hair), I've been told it was recycled linen. They were very brittle which is why you dont see many service pieces are some type of injection molded plastic. They fit fine but don't have the texture of original


That type of appearance IIRC was often called horse hair although generally it wasn't.
Same for the heater box.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,069 Posts
For what its worth, the original fan shroud on my 1970 vert has a lot more 'hair' in it than what is shown in the ebay link.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,807 Posts
The link shows a shroud that IMHO looks allot closer to the service replacements than the original ones. All depends on how far your going with the restoration ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
687 Posts
Didn't mean to imply that the material was the same as the heater box, just seems similar to it. Trying to describe it to someone who hasn't seen one is tough. :shrug:

The only references I can find for application of the shroud always mention "for models with air conditioning". Does this mean that models without AC had no shroud? The reason for my question is page 164 in the Osborne Engine Equipment Assembly Manual shows the cooling set up with no shroud (STD. OR EXTRA COOLING- Mustang &S77 GT) and page 165 specifies MODELS WITH AIR CONDITIONING and shows the shroud as well as specifying it in the parts list at the top of the same page.

Sorry for the post hi-jack Angela, but curiosity got the best of me and I'd hate to see you spend good money on a part that may not be needed.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,807 Posts
SpareTime said:
The only references I can find for application of the shroud always mention "for models with air conditioning". Does this mean that models without AC had no shroud? The reason for my question is page 164 in the Osborne Engine Equipment Assembly Manual shows the cooling set up with no shroud (STD. OR EXTRA COOLING- Mustang &S77 GT) and page 165 specifies MODELS WITH AIR CONDITIONING and shows the shroud as well as specifying it in the parts list at the top of the same page.

Shroud or no shroud depends allot on what year and engine your looking at.

And of course you [strike]can[/strike] CAN'T rely on the Master Parts catalog for this sort of detail ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
975 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
I 2nd Charle's last comment. :)

As I understand (and I'm no expert), 1967 390, smog-equipped cars had fan shrouds regardless of whether or not the car had AC. Please correct me if I am mistaken.

Thanks for the link to JD Larson's old ebay link photos!

So, in short, as of today, no one is aware of a reproduction that is similar to originals or service parts, correct?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,832 Posts
It is the extra cooling package that used the fan shroud. Extra cooling was automatic with AC cars but could also be a stand alone option.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,807 Posts
CharlesTurner said:
Jeff_Speegle said:
And of course you [strike]can[/strike] CAN'T rely on the Master Parts catalog for this sort of detail ;)
I really hope you mean can't!!! :)

That would be consistent with my previous comments ;)

Thanks
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
687 Posts
I'm no expert either but I like digging into this kind of thing.

I hate to keep going back to the same reference, 'cause it's only a single source, but...
page 186 and 187 show the thermactor set up. 186 show the thermactor with/standard and extra cooling and no shroud.
187 shows thermactor with A.C and a shroud.

According to what I can see in this book, Thermactor or extra cooling don't SEEM to be the options that triggered the inclusion of a shroud. Inclusion of A.C SEEMS to be the deciding factor.
All of this is just guess work based on one single source, so it (and I)could be wrong. But in my mind, Ford paid someone to illustrate 4 different set ups for a reason. I also think that if every 1967 390 equipped Mustang and Cougar came with a shroud, there should be more of them out there. The example that keeps coming to mind is the '67 deluxe seat clamshells. Made in limited numbers, delicate parts in a sometimes hard use situation. They seem to have survived in decent numbers tho not necessarily in decent shape.
If anybody has any other reference to the shroud usage, PLEASE let me know what it is. I have been pounding my head over this thing for a good long while now and would love to know if I'm right, wrong or just completely brain dead on the subject.

And no, it appears that no one is making a good reproduction shroud at this time. The closest I have seen is the one referenced in the link above. It's hard to tell, but I think Jeff says it's close to the service replacements.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,069 Posts
Of all things, I used to build hog confinement farms. There was a flooring that was somewhat popular to use that was an injected plastic with fiberglass in it. It looked just like the fan shroud on the vert. The problem was that the flooring was very brittle and the tabs that held it together broke off over time or even during install.

I have a feeling that a lot of these shrouds were tossed over the years when engines were pulled. People didn't understand the need for them. Then, because they were so brittle, they probably broke apart. This reminds me that I need to make sure I am protecting the one off my vert!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,807 Posts
SpareTime said:
........... But in my mind, Ford paid someone to illustrate 4 different set ups for a reason.
Also consider that Ford paid someone to illustrate the page that those pages replaced and may have paid another illustrator to redraw them the next day. Please understand that the pages that your looking at are a collection of pages from a number of versions of that manual that were assembled to give us what we see today. Jim had multiple copies from different parts of the production year but most could not be used due to insect and water damage.



SpareTime said:
I also think that if every 1967 390 equipped Mustang and Cougar came with a shroud, there should be more of them out there.
Not sure if that holds true I can think of a number of parts that I have never found on a Mustang though they were installed originally. How many heat shields or plastic PS hose straps do we find on vehicles after all these years?


So back to your specific need - Your interested in 67 390 radiator shroud applications? And at what plant? Since this may make a difference

Also consider that sometimes we just don't know and it may take years to figure this out. ;)


Here is a couple of close ups of an original (not sure how well this will work) Hope everyone can make out the texture with the "hairs" )take notice of the surface in the reflective area of the picture). I keep a damaged piece for seminars







Here is a close up of a service replacement


 

·
Registered
Joined
·
687 Posts
Jeff
Thanks for the pictures! Those are terrific at detailing the texture!

I think Angela was after info for a late June 67 San Jose build.

I realize that the book is a slightly fuzzy "snapshot in time" of what was actually happening and running changes were implemented all the time, and differences in procedure occurred from plant to plant. That is why I hate that it is only a single source. I do not envy any of the judges jobs! I am extremely grateful to have this type of information available. You guys do a terrific job of keeping up with a huge amount of info and I am just amazed that we are able to ask this type of question and actually get an answer!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
975 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
Jeff, yes, I am specifically asking about a June 30 '67 SanJose build, 390 C6 w/thermactor, no AC.

I'm digging through pictures prior to tear-down and hope to find some clues. The engine bay showed no evidence of ever having been repainted and I distinctly recall seeing evidence that a shroud had been there (no shroud present when I obtained the car but there were tabs from what could have been the shroud). Of course, in 40yrs someone could have added an aftermarket shroud to keep her cool. I do not recall the texture of the pieces that remained.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,832 Posts
Were (or are) there little j clips on the radiator straps that the shroud screws would have mounted in?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,832 Posts
Here's a 67 390 C6 Thermactor no AC SJ car I inspected earlier this year. Its been partially restored but is a 25K mile car and I certainly don't think he would have put an original fan shroud in the car unless it was there to begin with. He chose not to put the Thermactor back on but it is all there. I seem to recall it was an early car,
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c74/tlea/DSCN2564.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c74/tlea/DSCN2567-1.jpg
 
1 - 20 of 25 Posts
Top