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Much is made of working a clutch but your grandmother could do it and I bet she embraced progress more than some of you, did that make her more manly? True for some.
You're just not reading what's being said. It's not about anti-technology or being manly, it's about having fun. By you're logic, us car enthusiasts should all be riding in the latest hi-tech. electric auto-drivng cars, because that's the latest-greatest right ? :)
 

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Here is what I have always thought:

Ford really missed the boat when they let the T-Bird stray. Instead of turning it into a 2 1/2 parade float, they should have done like Chevy did with the Corvette and stick with the initial vision: 2 seat sports car. Yeah, Ford has the highly desirable GT but who can afford it? Build something sub 100K. Ford already has expertise in the mid engine arena, think about it, Ford could be 30 years into a mid engine T-Bird by now.

Now, looking at the flip side, Ford hasn't divided their market the way Chevrolet has done. The Camaro has advanced to the point is steals sales from the Vette and now it is about to die a second death wear as the Mustang has been in continuous production. Possibly if Ford had an af-FORD-able high end sports car, it would have sucked sales away from the Mustang leaving it with low numbers.

I think that the sales managers at Chevy are looking at a lot of those factors, choosing to kill the Camaro at the same time they are rolling out the next great generation of the Vette.

I am really a hardcore Ford guy, and not the biggest fan of the Vette but I have to admit that it is definitely a worthy contender against the other 2 seat powerhouses of the world.
 

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Discussion Starter #63
Here is what I have always thought:

Ford really missed the boat when they let the T-Bird stray. Instead of turning it into a 2 1/2 parade float, they should have done like Chevy did with the Corvette and stick with the initial vision: .
At the time it looked like a slam dunk though as they sold 4 times as many T-Birds once they put 2 more doors on it.

If we listed all of the sins of Robert McNamara, overseeing change of the t-bird from a sports car to a family car wouldn't make the top 1000. Agreed...it would be on the list somewhere...but near the bottom of the list.

Phil
 

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As we all know, it's all about the bottom line and Ford made a killing when they morphed the TBird into that 2½ ton land barge. The TBird name had a long run but eventually the sales numbers dwindled and it had to go. Now all they make except for the Mustang and trucks are econo-$hit boxes and that's what disappoints me.
 

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No, by my logic car enthusiasts are mostly oxymorons. Maybe not specifically but like the guy that wants big power with fat tires just to burn rubber. Some will buy it just because... I get it, I just don't try to rationalize it. If you don't want the latest and greatest of America don't buy this Corvette. You can buy brand new throwback cars from the small lot makers. Buy one from the last 25 years that will handle better and go faster than you need until you compete against a clock. By every metric a sports car is measured by the DCT does better, the mid-engine does better and someday a hybrid drive will do better. Ask Hurley Haywood why the other company only offered a PDK in a certain car, "because it was faster, we didn't consider what the customer wanted, we made the fastest possible car" paraphrased.
Don't worry, with the clutch by wire system in about 2 years Chevrolet will offer a third pedal connected to a rheostat and a handle that clicks a button in the car followed by a new sales campaign, "What's Your Excuse Now!"
 

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I think I get your point, it just sucks that eventually those who want to "row-their-own" will be relegated to classic and antique cars.

Eh, I guess eventually the I/C engine will go away too, though I expect I'll be dead before then !
 

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I was talking with the GM of the local Chebby dealer here yesterday. He said their allocation of Corvettes last year was 27...they are getting 44 C8's...another dealer nearby(big volume corvette dealer) got 630 last year...he's getting 1300 C8's...he said most Chevrolet dealers are getting DOUBLE WHAT THEY GOT LAST YEAR. He also said that there are 30000+- unsold C7's and we are going into August with a new model coming....short production timeframe means less time to sell the new models(change over is usually august) . They will have 8 months rather than the usual 12 to sell twice as many cars. It's got some dealers pretty nervous. He said GM isn't even offering incentives on the C7's other than loyalty rebate of $3k... I think there are going to be deals on this car. I've already sweetened my deal... should be interesting how this plays out...my dealer has sold out of his 44(last year he only got 21) and Is happy bout That... can't even imagine how many. Mega dealer like Kerbeck Chevrolet (NJ) is getting...I think they are the Corvette King of the east...
 

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It's butt ugly. The rest looks great! A couple of decades overdue don't you think?

I don't get the scheming to make a fast buck unless you have the money to loss if it doesn't work out? I've seen the the quick Mopars that someone was going to flip for a big profit going for sticker or less on the auction shows.
 

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It's butt ugly. The rest looks great! A couple of decades overdue don't you think?

I don't get the scheming to make a fast buck unless you have the money to loss if it doesn't work out? I've seen the the quick Mopars that someone was going to flip for a big profit going for sticker or less on the auction shows.
Given the new info on the projected production numbers I have re-thought my plan already. I cut a deal with a local guy that wants one(because the first 3 months of cars are pretty much spoken for) and he'll take my spot if I decide not to keep it for myself.
 

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Kinda cool, wish they could be had with a manual transmission. Can't wait to see how they do on track.
A manual would be a horrible downgrade and a much slower and not as much fun to drive car. Might as well go with manual steering too. Well technically it actually is a manual in fact its basically two manuals in one controlled by two clutches and a computer running the clutches.
 

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Given the new info on the projected production numbers I have re-thought my plan already.
I've rethought it as well. If you still want to match with an older one you might do well if they are sold before the 1st 6 months of next year, a bit longer maybe. that is if you believe this. https://www.autoblog.com/2019/07/28/2020-chevy-corvette-nearly-sold-out/#slide-2156859 https://www.autoblog.com/2019/07/29/2020-chevy-corvette-analysis-concours-america/#slide-2156992 . I hope they are counting actual cash on the barrel deposits because Ive reserved one my self:grin2: Waiting for option pricing:wink:
It will be interesting to watch since they won't really run out of them but there seems to be a very long line building up.
 

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A manual would be a horrible downgrade - not as much fun to drive car.
Well, many disagree with you there :) It's all a matter of personal preference, but I don't know how you can say a stick shift is less fun :(

I agree. I grew up driving sticks. Nothing is as much fun as rowing through gears IMO.

But I also am forced to agree that a pure manual is a performance downgrade. With cars doing 0-60 in less than 4 seconds, those shifting delays, no matter how well executed, are added to the elapsed times. In a world where the C8 is shooting for performance equal or better than cars costing two or three times as much, I understand the decision to use a dual clutch auto.

But I do love a well sorted manual trans.

John
 

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A sub 4 second 0 to 60 is attainable using a conventional drive train, my FFR was consistent at sub 4 seconds 0 to 60 using a SBF and a T5 gearbox.
 

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A sub 4 second 0 to 60 is attainable using a conventional drive train, my FFR was consistent at sub 4 seconds 0 to 60 using a SBF and a T5 gearbox.
No, I get it. You can go faster than that as well with a Powerglide!

My point is that any hundredths of a second (or even a couple of tenths) saved by eliminating manual shifts comes off the ET, without having to add more HP. All things being equal, a DCT should be measurably quicker than a manual or conventional auto trans.

Added to this is the fact that more gears keeps the engine in the power band and means more performance - as long as the shifts can be executed quickly and cleanly enough.

In a high dollar world where exotic sports cars are made or broken on fractions of a second, a couple of tenths of a second saved on a 0-60, or quarter mile, or flying mile etc. is almost an eternity.


John
 

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IMO anyone paying a premium over sticker or buying one with the intention of flipping it for big bucks is an idiot. My buddys brother works in bowling green and word is they're hoping to break a production record set back in the late 70's. I believe the record is over 53k vettes built.
 
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