Vintage Mustang Forums banner

1 - 20 of 22 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
157 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I have a dilemma. I have a 65 6 cyl with drum brakes that I've converted to V8, and using 67 spindles with my own Brembo disc brake conversion (see other post). I have manual steering at the moment, which I'm going to stick with to start, but may upgrade to power later, if it's too heavy. My dilemma is this:

1, Do I keep my original steering components, and just make a pair of tapered bushes (I have the means to do this) to enable my original tie rods to fit the 67 spindles? This will cost me nothing but a bit of my time.

or

2, I buy 67 manual steering parts (tie rods, idler arm, centre link, pitman arm) at the cost of nearly $500, which includes a huge $160 shipping to the uk? This is what CJ Pony are advising, but obviously they want to sell me stuff.

Opinions please on costs, performance, strength etc.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,895 Posts
I think all you need is 67 tie rod ends but let others weigh in. You may have some bumpsteer issues and need a bumpsteer kit but I would wait and see how she drives first. If you run stiff suspension and lower the car as I did, I only get bump steer when I'm going very fast over a steep small hill where the car unweights significantly which is very rare so I'm happy with the system. I'm very sure @Huskinhano will weigh in with dimensions and details. I believe you have the same issues as those fo us with Granada spindles.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
157 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
I bought the 67 rod ends thinking they would fit, but the threads are much bigger.

I've done the Shelby Drop too.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
21,330 Posts
Your smart you didn't listen to them! You will need the 67 outer tie rod ends. The rest of the components are wrong and won't work. You need 65/66 V8 components. The geometry on the 67 & later spindles are slightly different. The horizon offset in the arms is 1/2" less, the tie rod taper is 3/8" inboard more and the center to center between the ball joint and tie rod is about 7/16" short on the later spindles to the 65/66. The later spindles should quicken steering.

You can get the later spindles to work well on your car. I have 72 spindles with no noticable bump steer.

I once bought a set of headers from CJ to pick up at a show. They sold them on me. They had to reorder for me which took a couple months to get back in. Once I got them they were poorly backed, just dumped into a box loose. The headers were for a Fox body Mustang. I called them up, CJ gave me a hard time insisting I had the correct headers. I asked why they had O2 sensor bungs? They straight up told me 66 Mustangs used O2 sensors! Another time I was in their store to buy tie rods. I gave them the info and the counter guy looks the parts up and comes back with I6 tie rods. I tell the guy wrong ones. He looks them up again and tells me they are the right ones. Well we went back and forth a few times until I got the moron to come to the parking lot and look at a 65 V8 car. Oh the guy said and finally got the right ones. I will NEVER EVER buy anything from CJ!.

Check out NPD, Opentracker Racing or Street or Track for suspension parts.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
157 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
So you are saying if I buy the 65/66 V8 parts, they will fit my car and will also accept the 67 outer tie rod ends? My original rods only have a 1/2" thread, but the 67's have 11/16", much bigger.

Your smart you didn't listen to them! You will need the 67 outer tie rod ends. The rest of the components are wrong and won't work. You need 65/66 V8 components. The geometry on the 67 & later spindles are slightly different. The horizon offset in the arms is 1/2" less, the tie rod taper is 3/8" inboard more and the center to center between the ball joint and tie rod is about 7/16" short on the later spindles to the 65/66. The later spindles should quicken steering.

You can get the later spindles to work well on your car. I have 72 spindles with no noticable bump steer.

I once bought a set of headers from CJ to pick up at a show. They sold them on me. They had to reorder for me which took a couple months to get back in. Once I got them they were poorly backed, just dumped into a box loose. The headers were for a Fox body Mustang. I called them up, CJ gave me a hard time insisting I had the correct headers. I asked why they had O2 sensor bungs? They straight up told me 66 Mustangs used O2 sensors! Another time I was in their store to buy tie rods. I gave them the info and the counter guy looks the parts up and comes back with I6 tie rods. I tell the guy wrong ones. He looks them up again and tells me they are the right ones. Well we went back and forth a few times until I got the moron to come to the parking lot and look at a 65 V8 car. Oh the guy said and finally got the right ones. I will NEVER EVER buy anything from CJ!.

Check out NPD, Opentracker Racing or Street or Track for suspension parts.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
21,330 Posts
So you are saying if I buy the 65/66 V8 parts, they will fit my car and will also accept the 67 outer tie rod ends? My original rods only have a 1/2" thread, but the 67's have 11/16", much bigger.

Correct. On my 66 I have 65/66 inner tie rods. I have a Baer bumpsteer kit designed for 70-73 Mustangs and it fit with the 66 tie rods.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,552 Posts
Your smart you didn't listen to them! You will need the 67 outer tie rod ends. The rest of the components are wrong and won't work. You need 65/66 V8 components. The geometry on the 67 & later spindles are slightly different. The horizon offset in the arms is 1/2" less, the tie rod taper is 3/8" inboard more and the center to center between the ball joint and tie rod is about 7/16" short on the later spindles to the 65/66. The later spindles should quicken steering.
Just a quick hi-jack. Is this also true for the 70 spindles going on a '66?

Allen
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,142 Posts
Just a quick hi-jack. Is this also true for the 70 spindles going on a '66?

Allen
this post from "Mustang Forums has a good set of pics showing the difference between 6cyl and V8 sterring V8 Pitman ? - MustangForums.com
basically you need everything below the steering box. Pitman, arm Idler arm, inner tie rod, and then go with the adjusting sleeve and outer tie rod of the spindle your using (by the way this is an excellent time to speed up the Slow : 1 box with the Shelby quick steer kit )
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
157 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
Ok, so I need all the 65/66 V8 manual steering parts, apart from the 67 outer tie rod ends, which I already have. If someone were to convert their manual steer V8 to power, would they have to replace all this? And therefore maybe have them for sale?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
37,647 Posts
Ok, so I need all the 65/66 V8 manual steering parts, apart from the 67 outer tie rod ends, which I already have. If someone were to convert their manual steer V8 to power, would they have to replace all this? And therefore maybe have them for sale?
Depends on which power assist method you choose. If you go with EPAS you don't need to change anything.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
21,330 Posts
Just a quick hi-jack. Is this also true for the 70 spindles going on a '66?

Allen
Allen, I have 72 disc brakes on my 66. I used a Baer bumpsteer kit for 70 & up. The kit use a threaded barrel with jam nuts. The 66 inner tie rods threads in no issue. The only time I had issues was years ago when I had some no name off shore parts that had metric or something. A name brand, no problems I can see.

I'll tell you right now, just put in all the spacers and call it a day. I run 4° + caster and 1/16" toe in. That seems to work very well at least on the street. With sticky tires you may see some bumpsteer, I don't know.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
21,330 Posts
I did a rough calculation that you need ~ 5° + caster to help offset the 1/2" less difference in the tie rod arm on the later spindles. It will put the outer tie rod roughly the same distance off the road surface as a stock 65/66 spindle with factory 0°-1°+ caster.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
157 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
Thanks. I will keep that in mind when I get as far as setting up the front suspension.

I did a rough calculation that you need ~ 5° + caster to help offset the 1/2" less difference in the tie rod arm on the later spindles. It will put the outer tie rod roughly the same distance off the road surface as a stock 65/66 spindle with factory 0°-1°+ caster.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
157 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Quick question: I'm part way through putting all these items in my basket at NPD (haven't got as far as seeing what the shipping costs are yet!), and will the 65/66 V8 idler arm fit the existing 6 cyl idler arm bracket?

Also, some of the descriptions are a little vague. Am I right in thinking the Pitman arm is the same for the manual steering and power steering? I don't want to ship the wrong parts across the Atlantic.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
21,330 Posts
Looks like the idler arm and bracket is different. The V8 has a shaft with a nut to hold the arm on the bracket. The I6 looks like a "L" shape bracket and the arm has a balljoint with a stud
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
157 Posts
Discussion Starter #19
Yeh, I'm inclined to agree. Ok, I better look for the bracket again. Must be on there somewhere.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,348 Posts
Check RockAuto as well.
 
1 - 20 of 22 Posts
Top