Vintage Mustang Forums banner

1 - 18 of 18 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
36 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hey all, happy to do my first post and I have to say you all blow me away with your knowledge.
Here it goes, I have set up my "65 coupe with granada front discs but have yet to drive it. I just read on mustang steves site that I am compromising handling using the granada set up. He also mentions a (bumpsteer problem) Honestly, I don't really know what bumpsteer means. I do have the original spindles so if this is going to be more of a problem than what it's worth, I'd like to know it now. I went with the granada thinking it's a bigger car so the braking should be great, and of course the costs. Any help is appreciated
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
332 Posts
Quick google search for the proper definition of "bump steer"
bumpsteer

which might also play into the 'handling' issue, honestly ive never heard of a major problem and have had several recommendations for the Granada swap

you said you used your stock 65 spindles with Granada rotors?? i didnt think they would fit right, how did you mount the calipers? does the car have the V-8 spindles or straight 6?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
36 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
no, I said I have the original spindles, I used the granada set-up with the granada spindles
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
36 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
and I have to agree, I never heard of a handling problem using the granada set-up until today. I have an issue or two using this setup, while researching these, I ran into the handling issue.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,998 Posts
I'm pretty sure it's known that the Granada setup causes a noticeable amount of bump steer. In short, the geometry is incorrect for the Mustang and small 'bumps' in the road will cause the car to react as if it's being steered erratically. IMO I'd stick with the spindles that are correct for the car and just do a disc conversion, but it really depends on what you're using the car for. Sounds like a performance/cruiser, in which case stay with the Mustang stuff and sell the Granada stuff.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
515 Posts
I did the granada swap years ago and even found good pads through Porterfield. Worked fine but later, I wanted larger calipers and went with Mustang Steves 05 brake conversion. The late modle brakes are larger, 12.5 inch and easier to find performance pads for. The down side is that 15" rims will not work and I had to modify the Mustang Steve kit to allow me to use 4.5" backspacing on my 16" rims.
Bottom line, both set ups worked great, I do have a set of 15" Magnum 500's I can't use with my current set up.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,983 Posts
no, I said I have the original spindles, I used the granada set-up with the granada spindles
Is the car originally a V8 or I6? If it was a I6, your spindles wont work if you go with a set of 5 lug disks.

Lynn
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,935 Posts
Many people have done the Granada conversion, some say
they have bumpsteer issues others say they don't have any
problems at all with it. If it's a problem with your car you can
get a kit that is suppose to correct the bumpsteer issue,
it repositions the tie rod end in relation to the spindle.

There is also a vendor that makes a Granada spindle that uses the
65 Mustang steering geometry if you want to go that route.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
36 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
Hi all, I appreciate the replys to my question. I hear all of you. My car is a C code V8, stick, I'm doing the 302 and a toploader 4 spd. I will post pics as I get better at using this site. It took me a week to even get a post in here, (my fault) but I have been reading/lurking for a long time. I am a long time mustang fan with alot of backyard knowledge to hopefully add, I just want to say you guys are amazing....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,578 Posts
If its in try it...

I have the granada change and I don't really notice a problem but I do have 620 springs up front so I'm not bouncing a lot. Since its already installed, try it and see if you are unhappy. If so change it, otherwise, do what so many of us do, drive 'em...

good luck,

M
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
36 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
good point, I have new stock springs and did the 1" upper A arm mod, Looks like I'm going to learn alot, which is all good, but I need to learn the easy way, instead of the expensive way. BTW, I am a backyard Mech, but I have her in a nice shop that was built just for her. No Joke. This one is the first of hopefully many...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
210 Posts
I have granada brakes on my 65. My car has manual steering and I have been told that you will have less bump steer with a manual steering car. I have had no problims with bump steerat all. I am very happy with the granada brakes.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,712 Posts
Hey all, happy to do my first post and I have to say you all blow me away with your knowledge.
Here it goes, I have set up my "65 coupe with granada front discs but have yet to drive it. I just read on mustang steves site that I am compromising handling using the granada set up. He also mentions a (bumpsteer problem) Honestly, I don't really know what bumpsteer means. I do have the original spindles so if this is going to be more of a problem than what it's worth, I'd like to know it now. I went with the granada thinking it's a bigger car so the braking should be great, and of course the costs. Any help is appreciated
I believe if i had the Granada brakes, all was in good working order, I'd work with them. I'm certainly not a Granada brake supporter, but expense is a factor in this situation, You already have them.

If on the other hand if you will need to completely rebuild, replace worn out components, then the Factory Disc brakes would be the best choice, which will bolt on those V8 Spindles.

As for Better braking! If you install the Factory 65 66 K/H Disc brakes setup, You will have Bigger Brakes than those Granada brakes, Just the opposite you have been led to believe.

Rotors on 65 66 11 19/64"
Rotors on Granada 11"
Calipers on 65 66 4 per caliper
Calipers on Granada 1 per caliper.

Dan @ Chockostang
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
353 Posts
Rotors on 65 66 11 19/64"
Rotors on Granada 11"
Calipers on 65 66 4 per caliper
Calipers on Granada 1 per caliper.
The dimensional difference in the rotors is insignficant.

Historically, the rationale behind the Granada swap vis-a-vis the original 4-piston KH setup was the relative scarcity and cost of parts for the earlier setup. With the passage of time, and as reproduction pieces get more common for the earlier cars and the Granada recedes into (some would argue, well-deserved) obscurity, this becomes less compelling.

Oh, and as for the '68-74 pin-floating calipers, the less said the better, my experience is they wear the pads unevenly and have other unpleasant characteristics, the Granada sliding design is much better.

You can argue all day long on the benefits of a fixed-mount caliper vs a sliding caliper, Detroit ditched the fixed-mount opposed-piston caliper for the sliding-mount single piston caliper for two reasons:

a) Cost - this drives almost everything in Detroit (and elsewhere in the auto industry). There's a lot fewer machining operations in a single-piston caliper.

b) Pad knockback - if you have a sloppy wheel bearing or runout in the rotor, the pads in a fixed-mount caliper will get pushed back and the next pedal application will have a bit of a 'where the HELL are my brakes?' feel to it, floating calipers are less sensitive to this.

Absent these considerations, if you've got straight rotors and snug bearings (and rigid parts - flex in the hub or stub-axle was a potentially-fatal problem in the '00 Cobra R) a fixed-mount multipiston caliper generally provides better braking because of a more rigid caliper design, more rigid mountings, and better distribution of piston force (and dissipation of heat) across the pad backing plate.

There are also multipiston floating designs such as the 2-piston Mustang Cobra, C4 and C5 'Vette (all of which are Australian PBR products), S197 Mustang GT, etc. designs that offer characteristics somewhere in between.

If one looks around the industry today one typically sees single-piston sliding calipers on commodity cars, multipiston fixed-mount calipers at the high end, with everything in between in the middle. There's always outliers - BMW seems to have had some kind of philosophical aversion to fixed-mount multipiston calipers, even on very big, heavy fast-movers like the M5. Some manufacturers seem to have a fetish for piston count, with 8-piston calipers showing up on some Audis and etc. (I think these are generally considered to be functionally inferior to a comparable 6-piston setup, and horrifically expensive, but then Audi's big on never using one part when they can use three.)

The KH four-piston setups came in two sizes, the small (Mustang) size and the large (Galaxie/Thunderbird/Lincoln) size, the latter was commonly used in e.g. Boss 302 Trans-Am cars with a bracket to retrofit them to the later drum spindle. These calipers were very effective but heavy; someone out there has reproduced them in aluminum but I don't recall who right now. I don't have any experience with these repros but on paper, at least, it should be an excellent setup.

Right now I'm trying to see if I can get a set of 6-piston Porsche Cayenne calipers on a late '60s Galaxie spindle; the Cayenne pads are absolutely hUUUUUUUUge.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,001 Posts
Just to clarify, "bump steer" isn't really that the car reacts to a bump. A bad alignment generally causes what many people erroneously call bump-steer.

Bump steer is a mechanical situation where arcs of suspension travel and the tie rod travel do not match. As the suspension cycles through its range of motion, it forces the steering to change.

That's very different from a bad alignment when you hit a small bump and you feel it through the wheel

So you could have a bad alignment but not have bump steer problems, and you could also have a nice driving car with a bump steer issue that doesn't show its face unless the suspension is compressed or extended a long way.

As far as Granada spindles, I haven't seen any driveability issues on the 1/2 dozen or so I have done, but I always lower the upper control arm and set alignment to more modern specs.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
36 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
Thanks all, like I said in my first post, you all have amazing knowledge. I guess I'll stick with the granada setup and make up my mind after driving her for a while. Now that I know what bumpsteer is, I'll put the suspension to the test and see if I get any odd responses outta her. I have already bought all the new stuff ie: rotors, calipers, pads, hoses and bearings, even got the mustang/granada tie rod. Yeah, I have a few bucks wrapped up in this setup already.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
332 Posts
I have the granada change and I don't really notice a problem but I do have 620 springs up front so I'm not bouncing a lot. Since its already installed, try it and see if you are unhappy. If so change it, otherwise, do what so many of us do, drive 'em...

good luck,

M
Thats very good to know about the springs, i recently completed the Granada swap on my 67 and utilized the Grab-a-trak suspension kit from Mustangplus and it came with the 620's... engine is currently being rebuilt so i havent had any road time to experience for myself
 
1 - 18 of 18 Posts
Top