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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Were to begin.
Ok....

1. Keyways - 1/16 play side to side causing an advance on throttle up and retard on throttle down situation that machine shop believes contributed to the failure

2. One main was spun and a second about to, the crank needs to be turned.

3. 4 of the pistons show 'unrecoverable' score marks on the side by being rocked in the cylinder from pinging and fighting the keyways

4. Block needs to be bored.


Prognosis - Fatal.


Action Plan:
1. Obtain new block - found local source for standard bore 351 block (price negotiable, but I don't don't know what to pay), also old block was a 4 bolt set up, I doubt I will find one of those local if it all.

2. Contact Ross and/or speedomotive and bitch them out about making pistons for open chamber heads when I told them I had closed chamber heads and try to negotiate a low replacement price....probability - low, since I am so mad Speedomotive will end up hanging up on me when I unload in the ear, and ross will just say "hey Speedo gave us the specs"

3. New heads are already bought and in transit.

4. Right now I can afford a little at a time, for example, the heads, and now the block, with the machine work (parts and labor) bills coming in a 4-6 weeks. I can't afford to drop this and just invest in an all new assembly so I think I have to (and really feel like I want to) keep the c setup.
 

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I'm sorry to hear this, it seems like its only getting worse. Soon enough things will get back together again. Good luck, keep us updated as your doing!
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
The longest wait is going to be in the pistons :(
They have were custom made, and will have to be again.

I suppose the real question is, do I go back to Ross at all?
 

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I've heard some bad things about speedamotive !
I infact was considering them when I went for the crate motor in the Mach, they were very evasive about my questions and never realy got a straight answer, so i decided not to give them my money, Now I am very Glad I didn;t.
 

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I thought all the Cleveland blocks had the material in the main webbing for 4 bolt mains. If so, you could have your old main caps put on the new block. That would mean tapping the additional bolt holes and line boring the block... Maybe that's not worth it... Just buy a main girdle kit; it'll be cheaper and probably more effective.
 

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Wow Nick,
That stinks, If you were closer I have a 72 351C that is a good block, you could have but it is a 2 bolt main not a 4.
Keep your chin up.
 

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I'm not sure, But I would consider putting the 4 bolt caps on the new block. If it is like the 429/460 all it would take is some machining and a line bore. Why not just bore and linebore the block you have, since you have to replace the pistons anyways? Why do the think the mains spun?
 

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Nick, I am sorry to hear that about your engine. Have you checked into the possibility of keeping the main caps from the 4V block & seeing if a 2V block can be machined to accept the 4V mains? I think I remember hearing that this can be done. Someone will probably correct me if I'm wrong.
Good luck with the project - something good has to come from all this effort.

Doug
 

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The keyway thingy is backwards . On throttle up it would retard and on throttle down it would advance . Chances are it would stay retarded the entire time since the camshaft load might change but should be constant enough to hold it against the key . If there was that much slop Im surprised it did not spin the key off the crank . I can't see the pistons being damaged from "rocking from the keyway" . Id give more odds on overheating or coolant inside the cylinder from the head gasket failure (or both) . They could fix your block , you could have it line-bored (or align bored , which every term you wanna use :) ) and that would fix the mains . Then you could have the engine bores that are in trouble sleeved , or sleeve them all . Sleeves are obviously not as strong as original walls and depend on the installation for them to be effective . If a idiot installs them they will falter soon .
I wish I had a 351C laying around , Id gladly donate it to your cause :)
It sounds to me you have some oiling problems , and I doubt a high volume pump is going to help the problem . Could have been a problem with the block losing oil pressure through a crack or open port , could be from the crank roping the oil at high RPM's ...
When you put this thing together again , invest in a crank wiper and install it correctly . Not only will you gain piece of mind , the scrapers will gain you HP so it makes it feel better splacking down $$ for them :)


Edit :
Im not sure of your talking about crank shaft keyway or piston ring lands ?
 

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if your block is not salvageable(sleeves ?) then you can take your 4 bolt caps and use them on a 2 bolt block. the 2 bolt is cast and machined all except drilled for the 2 extra bolts. it will of course need to be align honed for proper fitment. I wish you were closer I have a 2 bolt main block I'd sell ya for $50 that is standard but needs bored. it would be perfect for what you need to do.

as for Ross, I'd try talking to him and calmly tell him that you will be forced to take legal action if he does not help in any way you deem feasable to correct the mistakes HE has made(did he do all the machine work ? order the pistons etc..) he is responsible and should be held accountable. and he knows that bad word of mouth travels faster and farther than good. just be patient and calm and maybe call from the new machinists office with him listening. heck I'd even tape the conversation if I could. may not hold up in court but it will be proof of what he says. and if ya can't find a block I'll be happy to ship it IF we can find a carrier. cheer up!!! you could always be MIDLIFE :: heck or ME for that matter(my luck sux)
 

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Man Nick, that sucks. Which heads did you end up getting, open or closed chamber? It seems like if they are open, someone should make a piston that would work that is not considered a custom item. I think I have 10.5 Badger pistons in my C with .030 and D3 CJ open chamber heads.
 

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Well, I guess this means that nothing from the original drivetrain from DT will be carried over. If only you knew that at the beginning of your travails....

I'm sorry to hear about your continued problems. Perhaps you should have postponed buying your heads until the results of the block analysis was completed.

Bummer.
 

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Can the machine shop sonic check the block? I thought some 351 c block could go more. I have a 429 cj block at 4.500 bore with no filler and it doesn't run a bit hot.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
I need a stroker piston...this was a 408 kit.

As for Ross....they only did what Speedomotive asked them to do.
 
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