Need some serious advice folks.

2914 Views 43 Replies 15 Participants Last post by graywolf_14, Dec 30, 2011

Pmustang

Discussion Starter · Dec 26, 2011 (Edited)

Okay. Bit of a story first. Car is a 1967 GT fastback. I bought it out of GA USA after looking for a while for a good solid car i could buy and enjoy My goal was to get a nice solid car that had some looks and drove well. I paid top dollar for a car with the right options and seemingly correct condition. What i got on the other hand was this Well here's the rub

The good.
Factory red GT with tach dash. Upper and lower consoles and other assorted goodies
As far as I can tell after gutting the interior for a look see the shell itself is very solid with perfect original floors and great condition in most all usual problem areas. Firewall, trunk floor, below rear glass perfect
Decent running highly detailed incorrect year (1966) 4bbl engine. 289 with pony restored correct carb. Alloy cobra intake. 4 speed.
Well detailed driver car both underneath and in the engine bay.
Interior vary nice
Reams of receipts for new parts. New suspension and all trim

The bad
Front crossmember bent to hell but no damage to frame rails or surrounding metal. Definitely needs replaced.
Drivers side inner fender has been wrinkled. Not horrid but needs massaging. With this it would not hurt to replace front panel as top edge is damaged and would allow for access to the inner fender
Paint is a 20 year old job. It was good in the day but is now a ten footer. Well applied with no overspray but scratched and chipped
Engine sounds and looks great but not powerful at all. Car came with a dyno sheet showing 165 flywheel HP which I am told is about right for a stock 4bbl 289
Doors are crap. I have new ones coming over as these are patched but not repairable to a correct level
Hood is wrong for a delux exterior car. I have a new one coming over
Rear quarters have a small amount of bondo at the very back edge along the wheel well
Steering box is both incorrect ratio and sloppy. Have a re built box coming over.
Front quarters although very solid vintage units are not original to the car and have filled mustang script holes. You can't see them from the exterior but I knw they are there
Seats are non comfortweave but should be so I assume they were recovered at a time the material was not available.

Okay. Still with me?.

I have quite a bit of money in the car at this point. Well over 40k US and probably closer to 45 with the parts I have bought. (remember I had to ship and pay taxes on it).

Where I am a now is that I am both unhappy with the performance, the paint and the body issues on the car. I could pay to get the, corrected but it pains me to do so as I was after a car that did not need this done ( an inspection is cheap insurance folks although a friend had an inspection on his and has similar problems)

The thing I don't want to do is get critically buried financially in the car. I am happy to get a foot buried but don't want to go the whole 6 feet I have done it before and it's not a fun place to be. I know some will say its a hobby and life is short but going at it the way I am I will have 50k united kingdom pounds in the car and that's just foolish. That would be a stroker motor. Body and paint.

Okay. I currently have a stroker motor on order and was going to sort out the body and paint in the future. The motor build has not been started so I can redirect if needed

The new motor was going to be 7k pounds which is approx 10,500 USD. now I have had 20k USD ngines built in the past but I am now thinking I could either order a 302 based short block from the staes or better yet do some work on the current 289 to wake it up and then not have to deal with selling the current engine or changing the current exhaust at large expense for the stroker I had planned.

I am thinking I could freshen up the current engine. Do the bits of body work and stay more within budget.

If you read on this long I appreciate it. I have done so many projects that I am a bit gun shy at this point in regards to just writing checks.

Any comments or suggestions on how to move forward most welcome. Thanks folks. Peter

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zray

· #12 · Dec 26, 2011

I'm sorry you don't like the car. Surprises like that hurt the wallet and dampen enthusiasm. Fix the engine and drive it for a few years. Maybe the market will rise and pay for your mistake.

I would be remiss unless I mention you have no one to blame but yourself for not inspecting the car IN PERSON. And even if you had paid someone for an inspection, like your friend did, it is a not a substitute for a personal inspection, it should only be a supplement for your own personal inspection. I paid for an inspection once, but didn't fork over any cash for the car until I had inspected the car myself, even though the paid inspector gave the car the green light.

If you can't travel to the car, don't buy it. no exceptions.

Z.

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zray

· #13 · Dec 26, 2011

slim said:
".......My advice is if your fastback is basically what you wanted and is solid/usable what you spent/paid is sunk cost. Has nothing to do with the future. It's like if you own some stock that that you paid $50/share in 2005. Now it's selling for $20/share. That's where it is now.
........."
Slim

and the OP hasn't "lost" any investment unless he sells, just like the stock market.

Z.

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zray

· #17 · Dec 27, 2011

Pmustang said:
"....Would be interested to hear what can be done to the 289 to get it a bit more lively. I assume heads and a cam and headers would be a start. i have done a paxson in the past and it sapped too much low end for my tastes? ........"

set up right you shouldn't lose any power at any rpm (over 1,200-1,300) from a vintage Paxton. In only a hundred rpm or so they are making much more power than it takes to turn the pulley. At 2,000 rpm I'm producing 2 lbs. boost, at 3,000 rpm it's over 3 lbs. Jetting is not always easy and you have to be patient to get 100% of the potential.

Otherwise, If you've decided against supercharging, for about the same amount of money, in your place I'd get a set iron heads that have bigger valves, and flow decently, like these:

World Products 053030-1 - World Products Windsor Jr Cylinder Heads - Overview - SummitRacing.com

another cam suited to your needs

a 650 Holley carb

a 2.5" free flowing exhaust system like the magnaflow stainless

that should be enough to add substantial horsepower increase over what you have now at a cost of only $1,500 for all the about items.

Z.

p.s. re my previous post; I've been ripped off on a car purchase before, so I'm not unsympathetic to what you are going thru. Just vow to learn from your experience. No one gets thru life without a few scars...

Z.

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zray

· #26 · Dec 27, 2011 (Edited)

Pmustang said:
"........ Would alloy heads give the same result as those mentioned? .........."

yes, but they cost 3 times as much.

Pmustang said:
"....... 15 years ago when I had a Paxton put on the 289 in my convertible the speed shop told me it took 50hp to turn it. Maybe they were full of it the car was decidedly weaker on the low end after the install..........."

sounds like they were covering up for s lack of expertise with the installation. you should have had a power increase from 1,200 rpm and up. At full 6 lbs boost there is net HP gain of around 130 without any other modifications.

Z.

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zray

· #28 · Dec 27, 2011

Pmustang said:
"......... 15 years ago when I had a Paxton put on the 289 in my convertible the speed shop told me it took 50 hp to turn it. Maybe they were full of it the car was decidedly weaker on the low end after the install........."

A pal over at one of the supercharger forums found this graph for me. It's a little like deciphering a weather map, but the gist of it is that at maximum flow the supercharger is requiring about 24 HP, but at that point it's making about 150+, for a net gain of 125+.

At low rpm it's using 4 HP to drive it. It takes under 1/2 lb. of boost to overcome the horsepower loss at the low end. Note this is a graph of the older VS-57 from the 1950's. The SN Paxton series (Shelby used the SN-60 in 1966) is more efficient.

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zray

· #31 · Dec 27, 2011 (Edited)

Pmustang said:
"............. When it arrived I opened the box in the shop to inspect and thought it was damaged as I could not turn the pulled on the unit. The gypsy behind the desk told me it takes 50hp to turn it which surprised me as I thought it would easily turn by hand. .........."

there is normally some resistance to turning the supercharger pulley by hand. But they will turn. So there might have been some damage or improper assembly of the head unit.

at some point give vintage Paxtons another chance. Buy one from Craig of Paradise Wheels and you not only won't be sorry, but you'll have a lot of fun to boot. His contact info can be found here:
Paradise Wheels Contact Information - SuperchargerHelp.com

the site is also a good resource of information for the vintage ball drive Paxtons:

SN Series - SuperchargerHelp.com

Z.

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