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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
It was suggested (ahem) that I post my mistakes and keep quiet about my victories. Too many doofus type posts and not enough atta boys. Kind of gives the wrong idea about what this hobby is about. Hats off and my salute to you normal people who have normal cars and live balanced lives and can do a weekend mustang project in a weekend (haha). In honor of your achievement, this post is humbly dedicated to you.

tonight I painted three refills worth of primer surfacer in about 1.5 hours, including about an hour past mosquito time. The gun did not gum up as I poured LACQUER THINNER through the gun between refills. With the gun clean and paint flowing, the gun laid down a nice wet coat of primer with easy coverage. Did the hood, trunk deck, two fenders, rear valance, quarter extensions, headlight doors, plus one door. Did not drop the hose onto freshly painted surfaces, the paint gun ran out of paint at convenient moments, and it took only 20 minutes to disassemble and clean the gun at the close of the session. Yes, the painting went as it should and I learned a few more tricks to improve my technique, in terms of painting fenders in a way that the overspray from one pass doesn't put a coarse layer over previously painted areas.

So, again, I acknowledge the balance in these projects - it's not always my stupidity and indifferent fate joining in lockstep on these jobs.

It does look like the car will get painted completely, this month.
 

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Allright, Ken! /forums/images/icons/smile.gif I realize I was the instigator, but I wanted to make sure "life wasn't all a doofus" (and I've had my share /forums/images/icons/tongue.gif). Thanks for keeping us in the loop on your painting project...now I know who to call for some additional painting advice! /forums/images/icons/smile.gif
 

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Congratulations! It sounds like the evening was well spent.

Since I'm in the prep stages leading to a paint job on my '66 project, I'm curious about the gun your using and materials you've chosen. Are you using a fresh air respirator? Mind sharing the details? TIA.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I am using an HVLP gravity fed gun, brand name Artisan, which is a foreign knock off for a Binks gun. I paid $135 for it, which is about 1/4 of a binks gun. I also have a touch up gun, same brand, also an HVLP. I rarely use the touch up gun, just for smal parts off the car where the paint cup on the carger gun makes it difficult to access the nooks and crannies.

The car I am painting is a 66 coupe. It is outside on my friends side lot. This is by the river so there are nearby trees and the ground is basically fine sand. We built a 20 by 25 foot framework, about 10 feet rall, of 1/2 inch steel conduit, secured on one side to a fence and on the other, by pounding pipe in the ground then sliding the conduit inside the pipe. There is thick clear plastic over the top, two sides, and the back (with a slit in the back to open up the plastic and roll the car in and out, as necessary. The plastic is secured to the framework with binder clips. There are cross pieces, as well. At the other end of the tent is open to the air. The floor is covered with plastic tarts and everything is taped together with packing tape. The open end has a 7 foot tall wooden 3-sided framework of 4x4 posts, 2x4 side rails and 2x2s across the top. We hang parts from this for painting, store parts on the top pieces, and hang the fenders from the side rails for painting and storage.

since this is outdoor and there is plenty of air through the big opening, I do not use a respirator. Initially, I did not even use a mouth/nose mask. I use one of those from time to time, however.

I am using Dupont products - a self-etching epoxy primer over the metal, then a primer surfacer. I am using the Dupont economy line for this - I think it is Nason or something like that. The final coat is a chromatone - the Dupont normal line - single stage paint. I also have a quart of clear and will mix a batch of 50/50 color/clear for the final one or two coats.

For body prep, I am hammering and shaping most flaws with dolleys, body hammers, and a big flat piece of lead. I also have a 2.5 pound short-handled sledge which is useful. I am using evercoat filler products. Most filler used is metal-to-metal product. This is an epoxy paste with aluminum powder in it. I like it a lot cause it does not shrink, crack and will flex with the metal if the car is hit. Over this is a skim coat of polyester filler. The green stuff for "structural" filling and the pink, finer stuff, for skimming out panel waves. I use an air sander - a long flat 16x2.5 inch sander, not an orbital. For really rough filler I use 40 grit, then go to 180, then 400. The final sanding before painting, and between coats, is 400. As much as possible I use the air sander or a flat long board sander. I also have the new semi-rigid foam shaped backing "boads" for getting curves, etc.

My prior job I used a mask as it was in a garage. I use the filter style and replace the screw in filters before every use, cause they are only effective for about 8 hours exposure to the atmosphere. I had a downdraft blower I fabricated in the rafters of the garage, and also a blower pushing air out a window. It was still pretty intense. I used PPG products on that job. I switched to Dupont for this job because the PPG clear could not be mixed with the base unless you used a special activator/reducer combination, and I forgot the combination. No similar problem with the Dupont.

Well, that's about it for now. Block sanding is the key for a good final product and a clean paint gun is the key for an easily applied finish.

Private message me if you have questions as you go along.
 
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I like to hear about things like this because, this (hopefully) will be my profession later in life. I would like to prosue a job in body work and paint. I want to get a cheapo gun and use it on my ccar models but in most cases that would require a compressor. But i suppose when I hot rod a riding lawnmower(dont ask) I could do my own paint. HMMMM.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
You are correct about the air compressor. Most Home Depot style units are too small. You need a large tank (I have two tanks hooked up in series)and the ability to push out about 9 cfm without running the tank constantly.

Engine building and painting require completely different mind sets and skills. Painting requires a lot of patience, attention to detail, an artistic sense in your hands whereby you can fashion shape with metal and lead or fillers. Engine building requires an apptitude, or interest in seeing how things fit together and work in synergy. You don't have that in painting. A painter gets jazzed when he finally lays down a coat of primer and the block sanding comes out without requiring any additional filler. You've got to receive satisfaction from that. Most people are driven to achieve the end result, like geeting a motor to start or seeing the color on a car. A painter is driven by a love of process, almost. It's how you do it that is the fun part.

This is kind of the zen of painting. I hope it makes sense to you.
 

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Ken,

Thanks for the thoughtful response. I'm considering one of the turbine outfits because my compressor is only a 20 gal./5 HP unit and wouldn't be able to keep up, I'm afraid, especially with an HVLP gun.

It sounds to me that we share a lot of the same approach on getting the job done. I'll admit that I'm a bit intimidated by what I've learned about the danger of exposure to Isos in both SS urethanes and BC/CC systems, but the trade off seems to be that not using them means having to use either lacquer or acrylic enamel, neither of which is as durable. I've learned a lot from a few of the pro websites, Autobodystore. com and the Paintucation site, and have bought both Len Stuart's and Kevin Tetz's tapes.

Thanks again for the input and I'll definitely take you up on the offer to email you directly as the project progresses.

Ed
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Hi again, Here is a tip I'm passing along to save you some bucks. Instead of abandoning the compressor route, simply make or buy a spare tank. I have a 5 hp 20 gallon compressor. I found a tank in the basement of my hosue when I moved in. It is an old boiler expansion tank, plumbed with inlets and outlets. All I had to do was install which disconnect air couplings on each pipe - inlet/outlet. The tank is around 10 gallons or so. I use a 4 foot piece of air house which I had male nozzles crimped onto each end. I hook the tank up to the air compressor tank and hook the hose up to the "buddy pack" tank. I have a regulator and water separator at the outlet of the buddy tank. I have about $20 in parts into it. Works fine.

As for the toxic chemicals - the absolute best way to protect yourself is a suit, which includes an eyeshield and a portable fresh air supply hooked up to a respirator. I learned that your eyes can absorb the fumes and you can get "toxified" through the eyes. ON the other hand, the newest paints out of Europe are water based! Spees Hecker, which is carried by Dupont, has a water-borne paint. NOt used too much here, but you can get it.

As for me? I've been painting this last job with nothing more than one of those filters that covers your nose and mouth, like someone would use for drywall. It is a little better than the dust mask, costs about $2.50. I can get away from this because I am paint outdoors with all that fresh air around. Where are you painting? a garage? your own paint booth? Probably the easiest is to rent a paint both for a weekend and pull two 10 hour days. The paint booth should have correct venting, might even have an air hose hook up so that you can use the shop's air compressor. If I can't paint outside again for my own car, I'll go the route with a rented paint booth. probably haul panels to the booth one weekend, then flatbed the car carcess to the booth the next weekend.

Good luck! Oh, yes, I've gotten sick from the epoxy primer when I did not use a respirator and painted in a closed garage. OH boy, just minutes and you feel sick. The worst, however, was painting with spray cans of metallic copper paint. It has a weird base, something beginnign with an X. I painted my bedroom ceiling (after wallpapering it to look like a copper ceiling, texture wise.) I was sick as a dog for about 24 hours. Nasty stuff.
 
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