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1966 Mustang 289/306 3spd coupe, 1966 Mustang 289 C4 coupe, 1965/64.5 Mustang 289 4spd convertible
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Mine is not as well stamped, but I can tell the first character is a "7".
That would mean '67. Some (read most) were poorly stamped originally and some are down right gone if the block was ever decked on a rebuild. The blue item looks to be a spacer plate. Cool 9 23 65 date stamp I think. The black item is the inspection cover.
 

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1966 Mustang 289/306 3spd coupe, 1966 Mustang 289 C4 coupe, 1965/64.5 Mustang 289 4spd convertible
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Before you go out to find a new starter, you may want to read up on this thread: (or one like it)
 

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Discussion Starter · #24 ·
Before you go out to find a new starter, you may want to read up on this thread: (or one like it)
Thanks for this. I have the C4 auto, so I must need the /3/4" depth unit.
 

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Discussion Starter · #25 ·
A lot can happen in 50 years, so do not assume what it was is what it is.

A lot of sobbing and tears have followed with that assumption.

The 7F14 says 289, not 302. But someone who, in 1976, cracked their block on their 2 year old 302 could have grabbed this block from the salvage yard, tossed the "old" rotating assembly, and put in the "newer" 302 guts. Heck, it could be a stroked 347.

Do you have a flywheel or a flex plate? Do you have, or had, a starter for a flywheel or a starter for a flex plate.

Do you have a block (also called a spacer plate).

A lot of rabbit holes to run, but washers on the starter and shavings in the bell housing (or torque converter cover) cries pay attention now or pay $$ later.
White Hood Light Motor vehicle Green
 

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Note that I wrote this a long time ago, and if you want the quick answer, skip to the end. ;)
Which starter type for your small-block Ford? Note there are unusual setups not included in the outline below (such as 141-tooth Mustang II). Synopsis of starter interchange:
• The choice of starter is only dependent on the starter ring depth from the block plate.
• There are two starter ring depths for flywheels and flexplates - shallow and deep
• There are two types of SBF starters - short and long nose (shallow and deep engagement).

Issues that are not starter related, but necessary to have a working system are:
• There are two common tooth counts for SBFs - 157 and 164. The remaining parts are all based on the tooth count.
• The bell housing, block plate, flywheel and starter must all match to work (manual).
• The bell housing, block plate, flexplate, torque converter and starter must all match to work (auto).

While there are exceptions to every rule, the following is usually true:
• Long nose—all auto except oddballs
• Long nose—all 157T manual cars 1980+
• Short nose—all 164T manual
• Short nose—some pre-1980 157T manual

Short and long-nose starter visual identification—the short-nose gear is almost flush inside the starter body. The long-nose drive gear is almost fully exposed above the starter body:

Property Interior design Liquid Grey Floor


Note the newer PMGR and the older direct-drive factory starter types both work in any year (with minor rewiring), as the nose (engagement depth) is the important factor.

Camera accessory Cylinder Automotive lighting Gas Auto part


The pencil test: If all else fails or to verify in one easy test—if you can not fit a pencil between the block plate and teeth, you need a short-nose starter. If you can, you need a long-nose.

I hope that helps, and other quick tips and facts to add to this are always welcome. :cool:
 

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Discussion Starter · #28 ·
I think I have an oddball.

Here is the measurement from the upper opening:

Blue Wood Line Font Gas


Here is the lower (used different ruler as this is an awkward spot):

Automotive tire Wood Amber Font Tread


And here is the nose of the starter (looks to be approx 2 3/4"):

Wood Gas Metal Auto part Machine


Block plate depth is supposed to be 3/4" or 3/8" and mine seems to be about 1/2" or 5/8" depending on what your supposed to measure (inside or outside depth). Is this an oddball?
 

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Discussion Starter · #30 ·
ALL SBF with Automatic transmissions take the same starter (Lester 3205/3168).
I get that - just wondering why I don't have either of the two standard depth dimensions. Autos are supposed to be 3/4" depth ring gear with a 4.084 starter registry hole in the block plate (per Powermaster's starter tech bulletin). My hole diameter is 4.084, but the depth is much shallower at about 5/8" (see photos above). When I pulled the starter, there were washers used as shims (about 1/16") in place... I must have an oddball...
 

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Thanks for this. I just wish I know why its an oddball depth...
Probably an odd-ball ruler.....

Reminds me of the story of the guy who end up building an addition to his house a foot closer to the property line than allowed. He took his old Stanley tape measure that was pretty beat up anyway, drilled the rivets from the tab on the end, sliced off a foot of tape and re-riveted the tab in place. When the building inspector showed up he handed him the tape and grabbed the end to hold in place.... lol.
 

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You have another problem it looks like. Is that the bronze bushing that has walked out the end of the starter housing that supports the bendix/armature? If so, then the bendix (aka Starter Drive, thing with the teeth) is wobbling around in there and probably cause a lot of problems. It might have allowed the bendix to walk forward into the ring gear, so someone shimmed it with a washer.

Look at the pics W427 posted. You need a long nose it looks like.

That core (or at least the nose) is probably trash. There is probably more experienced people here than me, but I have rebuilt several starters on a bench (when I wanted to keep the original) and had very good results replacing bearings, bushings, brushes, etc. You just have to do it before the starter has a major failure and destroys something.

Gas Auto part Metal Cable Machine
 
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Discussion Starter · #37 ·
You have another problem it looks like. Is that the bronze bushing that has walked out the end of the starter housing that supports the bendix/armature? If so, then the bendix (aka Starter Drive, thing with the teeth) is wobbling around in there and probably cause a lot of problems. It might have allowed the bendix to walk forward into the ring gear, so someone shimmed it with a washer.

Look at the pics W427 posted. You need a long nose it looks like.

That core (or at least the nose) is probably trash. There is probably more experienced people here than me, but I have rebuilt several starters on a bench (when I wanted to keep the original) and had very good results replacing bearings, bushings, brushes, etc. You just have to do it before the starter has a major failure and destroys something.

View attachment 854121
Thanks for pointing out what should have been obvious to me! I've tapped it back into place. Gear turns ok and on the bench I can't detect any wobble. Probably prudent to get a replacement at the parts store. Ttucky thing is will I have to shim it as well?
 

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You can use a small chisel to place a couple stakes on the face of the housing to prevent the bushing from walking out. That said, I'd look it over carefully to ensure there's no other damage.
 

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1966 Mustang 289/306 3spd coupe, 1966 Mustang 289 C4 coupe, 1965/64.5 Mustang 289 4spd convertible
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I'm just guessing here, but you think that walk out could be a sign of starter kickback? As in the bendix is pushing the gear too far forward into the flexplate (hence the shiming) that the engine is starting before the gear retracts, kicking the starter? Unsure, but I'd be looking at installing a new starter anyways.
 
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