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As many of you know I just had a Vintage Air system installed and have had no cooling problems until today on the way home (first really hot commute), by the time I got home the gauge was closer to the H than it was to the L (gotta love the idiot gauges!)and the motor was starting to ping pretty bad, really didn't do it long so I doubt there is any damage. I let it cool off and ran it under a load and no more ping. Looks like a radiator upgrade is in my immediate future...big surprise!

I have the stamped steel shroud and upgraded to the 5 blade fan, but the 2 row radiator is way too small to handle the new A/C load.

My question is this, Dallas Mustang has a 4 row radiator for $190 and a big fiberglass shroud for $90 more, will that be enough? I figure I'll go ahead and change out the thermostat (what temp???)as I have no clue what is in it now. I also plan to put in some Water Wetter, heard it knocks an additional 30 degrees too...will that do the trick? God, I hope so...my SWMBO might shoot me if I have to spend any more $$!!!

Help me Obi Wan VMFers...your my last hope!
 

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The 4-row will certainly help. I don't know that the shroud will, only trail will tell for sure.

With regard to the Water Wetter, or Purple Ice, or whatever... They are good for your system, but they don't work as well if there is anti-freeze in the mixture unless the anti-freeze is only about 10% or less.

Anti-freeze is a crappy heat transfer agent and defeats the benefits of a Water-Wetter-like product.

Run de-ionized water and water wetter or purple ice. If you feel the need to run anti-freeze as well, keep it to a minimum.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
...unless the anti-freeze is only about 10% or less.
Thanks for the help Kent, for those of us who are mathematically challenged artists, how would I figure amounts in a 4 row radiator?

And, do you think I'd be safe just keeping the stamped shroud instead of the monster fiberglass replacement?
 

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That's a good question. I would guess that if you felt you had to run anti-freeze that a quart would suffice.

The ONLY reason for anti-freeze would be lubrication, and I believe that the Water Wetter now covers that requirement as well. Check with Redline to be sure though.

Of course, if you live in an area where the winters require anti-freeze this whole water-wetter thing requires that you change your coolant twice a year.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Cool...no pun intended...I live in Dallas...100+ degrees in the shade this time of year, water and water wetter it is...just have to change it out come November

You think I can skip the big shroud then?

Thanks for all your help...thou art truly a VMF Jedi!
 

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Get rid of that 2 core. They do not cool enough for a small engine IMO. I know you don't want to spend the money but take a look at an aluminum radiator. I just installed one on my 69 and with a 180 thermostat the car has not went above 180 on a 95 degree day in stop and go traffic. That is not with my air on but that is another story. Good Luck
 

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All of the big 'glass shrouds I have seen have gaping holes at the bottom, which does not make them terribly effecient.

If you can afford it, an aluminum radiator and an electric fan are the ultimate solution.
 

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Decent shrouds make a big difference. The original style stamped steel shrouds are a joke. Contact whisperer when he gets back from Hawaii and get one of his shrouds (Vintage Autmotive). IIRC, they're about $80, but are amongst the best shrouds I've seen for a '65/'66.

I agree with Kent on the water wetter. Because of the heating problems we've been having in my daughter's '69, we're running nothing but water and Water Wetter in it, and have a nice shroud on it. She's going to have to fork out some $ for a new radiator before next summer, though (hopefully we're about done with 100+ degree days for this year).
 
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One important factor everyone is forgetting or maybe I just rear your post wrong. You said you have no idea what thermostat you have-that's the first thing you should ascertain. Change it with a 160-180 name brand and see how the car runs prior to putting more $ in at this time.
 

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Sort of agree with John re metal shroud but they've always worked for me, in the S. Fl. heat. With an 89 HO, in a 65, the four row, "skinny" metal shroud and a 180 was too much. Had to go to a 190 thermo. Yet, a friend in S. Ill. got his 66 to run cool enough with the addition of the plastic shroud. Have to agree with Kent about the anti freeze. A satisfactory lubricant would outweigh the reason for using any in a hot climate. I use distilled water and small amount of "coolant". Lots of variation in 39 year old cars!
 
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First, If you want a no-nonsense, science and fact based education on cooling go here for help.. http://www.inccn.net/techforum.htm and take a look at all the cooling tips. If I endorse any product it's based on performance or design and I do NOT have any affilliation with any product group! I have reseached automotive cooling for years!

Second, if you can get an aluminum radiator (two row with at least 1" tubes) they are about 30% more efficient than a four or five row copper and brass model. I would spend the money if you have air and a fairly hot climate. Go to

Third, air flow is the issue here as well, both for cooling and airconditioning efficiency. I recommend ditching that five bladed fan for the new technology Derale heavy duty fans at http://www.derale.com/flexfans.shtm and use the part number 17XXX only! These fans are excellent airmovers (even more than the famed Chevrolet big block/with air fans)at lower rpms and are quiet and are very efficient at higher rpms. I have put them on over 400hp applications here in "Hotlanta" with air in traffic with no problems. Size your fan the largest you can leaving only 1/2 to 3/4" in the shroud. They are also good looking and relatively cheap from Summit Racing at around $50. You will need spacers accordingly. If you feel better with electric fans then go for a Spal or Derale model. Spals are the cheapest from www.streetrodstuff.com

Fourth, the term "big" in shrouds has nothing to do with airflow per se. If the shroud you have fits well and you can insert at least 1/2 - 2/3 of the fan in the shroud a "bigger" one will not help one ioda! I have the aftermarket plastic shroud for my 70 Mustang with the Derale fan and it provides a very low pressure reading in the shroud meaning it's a pretty good design. It runs cool as can be.

REducing antifreeze content can help heat transfer as one poster smartly pointed out. We commonly run about 25% to distilled water and yes use an addditive package for corrosion such as WaterWetter or Purple Ice here in Atlanta. WaterWetter is a "surfactant" that alters surface tension of coolants making for better quenching and elimiation of trapped air and air/cavitation issues. The properties of this additive will improve heat transfer at a higher rate vs time, but doe NOT give the coolant the ability to absorb MORE BTUs. The use of surfactants with higher flowing water pumps and higher heat exchange capability (more radiator and airflow) will significantly increase the overall cooling capability of the system over a given time period, but will not necessarily REDUCE your coolant temperature if you do not have a way to get rid of the heat at the radiator end....which is usually the problem. I run WaterWetter just for the corrosion additives as well as cheap insurance. FWIW, today's water pumps do not need any kind of "lubricant" so to speak being a completely sealed bearing unit.

Also, changing a perfectly good thermostat to a lower temperature one does not GIVE the system to ability to cool better when the system is running constantly over the opening/cycling point of the thermostat. Thermostats serve no cooling function per se but just to control the "zone" of operation as long as the system has the cooling ability to operate in the "zone".

I hope this not too much information overload! :p
 

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Steve , one other thing about cooling problems at highway speeds, is that ANY opening that lets air go through the front of the car without going through the radiator is wasted.

High flow pumps are another thing too . If the water goes thru the radiator too fast , it can't transfer its heat to the air .
 

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I use 3 core with shroud and six blade flex fan and coolant recovery on my 5.0L. Works well even at 100+ degrees and a/c on.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
MAN...Thanks for all the info...you guys rock, I think I'm gonna go get the 4 row radiator and look at the shroud...just can't afford the aluminum job just yet!

And switch out that thermostat!

Thanks again all!!!
 
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