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Discussion Starter #1
A few weeks ago a member listed a C9OX intake for a fair price which I wish now I would have ponied up for since Ive been cruising the fleabay and wonder which I should pay up for or try to snipe if I see it. What difference would I have seen on a still stock for now but impressive '66 a-code.
I think I know what i don't want except despite a bad rap i'd love to try an Offenhauser Dual-Port for the heck of it:) It would go after any rebuild.

Anyway, im pretty sure I will want something sort of vintage so what differences are there, if any, between the C9OX and the later one which seems more rare marked Ford Motorsport? These are top 2 on my list for now. #1 C9OX marked FORD
Though i won't pay for a real vintage Cobra I wonder what is different in the S2MS and the SFJD? Other than the top holes are the new Cobra/Shelby re-pops based on one or the other? Anyone bought one in the last 10 years and how would one of those compare. Same same?

I also see some new BlueThunder Cobras. The ad said they are only made every 20 years or so. True?
I'm tempted to buy one of the new SD ones for $350-400 and run it a few years till its dirty then re-sell it for 2-3 X like I suspect many of the ones listed as "Original" are.o_O
Too bad the new Ford Racing ones just dont have the right look, they are only ~$225. I'd buy a new Weiand before that one I think

Bonus Q. What do people do or can do with the rear water passages on new ones? Would you use one to the heater if you wanted?
Happy Day you Mothers!
 

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I have a M-9424-A321 marked Ford Motorsport....see pics....also pic of C90x....I have been told and have read that the Motorsport models have smaller intake runners...which is why I got it...my thinking was that it would provide a better low end throttle response.....compare the pics and you will see that the Motorsport model has 2 extra bosses aft of the carb pad on the drivers side and the heater elbow is 1/2 " npt not 3/8 like the C90x....the wells beneath the runners look to be deeper on the Motorsport model also....I have never had them both side by side to really compare them.....
My 2 cents on it..........

sandybob
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A few weeks ago a member listed a C9OX intake for a fair price which I wish now I would have ponied up for since Ive been cruising the fleabay and wonder which I should pay up for or try to snipe if I see it. What difference would I have seen on a still stock for now but impressive '66 a-code.
I think I know what i don't want except despite a bad rap i'd love to try an Offenhauser Dual-Port for the heck of it:) It would go after any rebuild.

Anyway, im pretty sure I will want something sort of vintage so what differences are there, if any, between the C9OX and the later one which seems more rare marked Ford Motorsport? These are top 2 on my list for now. #1 C9OX marked FORD
Though i won't pay for a real vintage Cobra I wonder what is different in the S2MS and the SFJD? Other than the top holes are the new Cobra/Shelby re-pops based on one or the other? Anyone bought one in the last 10 years and how would one of those compare. Same same?

I also see some new BlueThunder Cobras. The ad said they are only made every 20 years or so. True?
I'm tempted to buy one of the new SD ones for $350-400 and run it a few years till its dirty then re-sell it for 2-3 X like I suspect many of the ones listed as "Original" are.o_O
Too bad the new Ford Racing ones just dont have the right look, they are only ~$225. I'd buy a new Weiand before that one I think

Bonus Q. What do people do or can do with the rear water passages on new ones? Would you use one to the heater if you wanted?
Happy Day you Mothers!
I have a Ford C90X on my 67 289 A code. HIPO cam and 465 cfm Holley #4548. Really wakes up the engine. I also have a SFJD and the plenum is split with a small notch. This is actually a better set-up than the early four design. There is always the Edelbrock F4B
 

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There is a lot of great info out there on dual plane ford intakes. Even an engine masters a couple weeks ago where they ran all the current offerings.

I've personally run the following. S2MS, performer 289 and Performer rpm, torker, SFJK and now an rpm air gap thats been ported. On a mild 289 or 302? I'd reach for the performer rpm. Probably followed by the SFJK or SFJD for looks/coolness factor. They're also a bit happier with the TBI injection setups people are running with the split in the plenum divider.

The SFJK made a bit more power than the s2ms. Which made the same as the performer 289. The performer rpm had the best range. Didn't dyno the Torker, but it wasn't very good on the street. The car currently rolls around with the ported air gap making 450hp.

The C90X, S2MS and edelbrock F4B are all very very similar. Whats being offered now from Blue thunder and a few of the others are slightly internally updated s2ms look alikes in a few different names. I've seen cobras, shelby and even holman moodys in the casting name pad. They are a very nice casting from Blue thunder. There are also some off shore cobras floating around that aren't as nice.

The Weiand stealth is an alright manifold. But the performer RPM and air gap will always top it.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I'm not sure why but I have totally unfounded and irrational dislike of Edelbrock, maybe the ugly carbs or because they seem to have to market cornered these days. Its overwhelming all the "Magazine" comparos that have their new stuff winning on Fords
....I have been told and have read that the Motorsport models have smaller intake runners...which is why I got it...my thinking was that it would provide a better low end throttle response.....compare the pics and you will see that the Motorsport model has 2 extra bosses aft of the carb pad on the drivers side and the heater elbow is 1/2 " npt not 3/8 like the C90x....the wells beneath the runners look to be deeper on the Motorsport model also....
That would be interesting if really so. It is my understanding also that smaller and/longer is better for low and mid ranges. +1 for the Motorsports model.
Good price for looks alone but look at this fugly repair. NEW 289 302 FORD MOTORSPORT 4V ALUMINUM Hi RISE INTAKE MANIFOLD M9424-A321 | eBay


. They're also a bit happier with the TBI injection setups people are running with the split in the plenum divider.
I see a few different ways in which the ports will have a port crossover with each other and even a few have said that using an open spacer has helped them but I havent found the theory on why it may be better with a carb.
 

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I just put the Offenhauser Dual Port this weekend on my 351... I got if for 5 bucks on Craigslist, wire wheeled and clear coated it. Runs very well and I have alot more power (bear in mind that swapped from the stock 2bbl)


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There is a lot of great info out there on dual plane ford intakes. Even an engine masters a couple weeks ago where they ran all the current offerings.

I've personally run the following. S2MS, performer 289 and Performer rpm, torker, SFJK and now an rpm air gap thats been ported. On a mild 289 or 302? I'd reach for the performer rpm.

The SFJK made a bit more power than the s2ms. Which made the same as the performer 289. The performer rpm had the best range. Didn't dyno the Torker, but it wasn't very good on the street. The car currently rolls around with the ported air gap making 450hp.
.
What is your definition of "mild" 302? I have a 68MY 302 in my 66... it was rebuilt stock with only a 260H comp cam, i have a wide ratio 4 spd, 3.00-1 gears and JBA mid length headers. I am trying to decide whether to run a factory cast iron or a Performer RPM ( I have both) along with a 500 Edelbrock I have for this combo...
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I just put the Offenhauser Dual Port this weekend on my 351... I got if for 5 bucks on Craigslist, wire wheeled and clear coated it. Runs very well and I have alot more power (bear in mind that swapped from the stock 2bbl)


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I'd try anything I got for $5 :)
I wonder if you actually gained HP or torque because of the way the ports increase velocity. They made a good sales pitch with the Dual-Port theory but I think most people judge by the top HP numbers.
 

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The dual planes tend to confuse the sensors a little bit in the TBI setups. Plus fuel distribution issues as you're not drawing fuel from the carb, it's being sprayed by injectors. I watched and read a lot on it. I notched my air gap so I could maintain adequate hood clearance over going with a big 1in (and ugly) spacer. Ideally a single plane would be best for them.. but they're all too bloody tall!!

I'm with you, edelbrock certainly has the market cornered. But they're also one of the few places that still casts manifolds. AND in the USA. I wanted something different myself, Thats why I tried the two shelby manifolds and kept thinking I'd get the blue thunder unit and port match it (instead of cutting up originals). At the end of the day, it was cheaper and gonna make more power to just go with the well tested Air Gap.

At the end of the day, they'll all be fine on a mild small block. Except the Torker II. Don't waste your money on that thing.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Funny how ideas can float around in the ether and meet kismet to make serendipity. :rolleyes:
Last week a friend/neighbor stopped by to try and sell me on an "old aluminum intake" a relatives friend of so and so had so I said "maybe" and bring it on over. He says if i don't want it to ebay it for him and I'll get a cut. I had to explain that ebay takes its own 10% cut first! I'll make a lower price listing here with more pics soon.
Although I could become a fan
KIMG1689.jpg


I cant find any idea of a date on it yet, do they have one?
Anyone know about how long they were actually made until?
Ive seen some with extra bolt holes behind the carb base that I assume are newer ones?
About when did Ford change the t-stat housing from the intake to the water neck? 80's with the 5.0? I see this one without the groove in the intake and it also has the extra threaded bosses behind the carb..
 

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A common edelbrock f4b. They made them easily for a decade, I remember seeing reference to 1977 but don't quote me on that. I do not think they ever reproduced them after production ended. A good manifold and 'period correct' albeit not as collectible or sought after as the Shelby and Cobra manifolds it should still be worth $250-375. The two ports up front are for temp sender and heater pipe. The back ones are for PCV and a vacuum port for power brakes. Extra bolt holes would indeed be a bit later. I think it was 5.0L EFI (86 up) that had the t stat change

Check for cracks in the t-stat housing and the threaded hole behind the t stat housing. Thats where they like to crack. They also usually end up with Helicoils in either the t stat housing bolt holes or the carb base bolt holes. I got a shelby one that was SO bad it wouldn't even take one and needed to be welded. How does the bottom look? No corrosion?
 

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I used to buy F4B, brand new, factory blems, for $10, right from the factory in Los Angeles, back in the late 60's early 70's.

Stock versus non stock. Long time ago, set up at a swap meet, and had a 4V intake, forget if it was aluminum or factory original. A person brought by the opposite, want the other one, and it was $50 plus the trade. A short while later, another person came by, and we did another swap, $50 plus trade. So I was back to square 1 plus $100. I did another cycle of that out there, so I took home whatever flavor I went out there with, and $200.

Older people: taking off the aftermarket, wanting original cast iron 4V

Younger people: Opposite.

Me: Middleman :)
 

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I used to buy F4B, brand new, factory blems, for $10, right from the factory in Los Angeles, back in the late 60's early 70's.

Stock versus non stock. Long time ago, set up at a swap meet, and had a 4V intake, forget if it was aluminum or factory original. A person brought by the opposite, want the other one, and it was $50 plus the trade. A short while later, another person came by, and we did another swap, $50 plus trade. So I was back to square 1 plus $100. I did another cycle of that out there, so I took home whatever flavor I went out there with, and $200.

Older people: taking off the aftermarket, wanting original cast iron 4V

Younger people: Opposite.

Me: Middleman :)
Lol... I don't think I will ever be old enough to put an iron intake on!!!

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I’ve got the Blue Thunder COBRA intake and it’s a sweet piece. Pricey, but if you’ve seen the absolutely ridiculous prices eBay sellers are charging for cleaned up but 50 year old F4Bs with wear and unknown issues, this brand new one isn’t much more. It’s just like an F4B and makes the car sing with my Holley 4160. I installed it myself, qualify level is high. Great power and I’m even pulling 20 mpg at times on it with a rebuilt motor 😜

Sounds like complete BS that they are made every 20 years. This one may be limited production but it’s probably a yearly run based in orders for Blue Thunder from what I’ve read; USA cast and machined.
 

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There is a lot of great info out there on dual plane ford intakes. Even an engine masters a couple weeks ago where they ran all the current offerings.

I've personally run the following. S2MS, performer 289 and Performer rpm, torker, SFJK and now an rpm air gap thats been ported. On a mild 289 or 302? I'd reach for the performer rpm. Probably followed by the SFJK or SFJD for looks/coolness factor. They're also a bit happier with the TBI injection setups people are running with the split in the plenum divider.

The SFJK made a bit more power than the s2ms. Which made the same as the performer 289. The performer rpm had the best range. Didn't dyno the Torker, but it wasn't very good on the street. The car currently rolls around with the ported air gap making 450hp.

The C90X, S2MS and edelbrock F4B are all very very similar. Whats being offered now from Blue thunder and a few of the others are slightly internally updated s2ms look alikes in a few different names. I've seen cobras, shelby and even holman moodys in the casting name pad. They are a very nice casting from Blue thunder. There are also some off shore cobras floating around that aren't as nice.

The Weiand stealth is an alright manifold. But the performer RPM and air gap will always top it.
fyi
just installed a F4B this past weekend on our well prep 66 289,
reinstalled the same pony carb prepped 1.2 4100.
very happy with bottom end torgue increase.
still need to fine tune the idle, stalls a bit when cold.
no dyno numbers but gave me a big bugs in the teeth grin to be sure.
shame I had that intake on the shelf for the last 6 years or so.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
According to Mannels book ,that change happened approx feb/mar of 1965.
Maybe Im saying it wrong or am completely mistaken but what i think I know is that up into the '70s there was a lip inside the intake and the water neck was flat.

While on some later ones the neck has the grooved lip and the intake face is flat. I assume the two shouldn't be mixed but it might not matter. No big deal really I guess its just safe to call them early or later made ones.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
fyi
just installed a F4B this past weekend on our well prep 66 289,
reinstalled the same pony carb prepped 1.2 4100.
very happy with bottom end torgue increase.
still need to fine tune the idle, stalls a bit when cold.
no dyno numbers but gave me a big bugs in the teeth grin to be sure.
shame I had that intake on the shelf for the last 6 years or so.
Did you have the stocker on before and what sort of cam do you have?
 

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Maybe Im saying it wrong or am completely mistaken but what i think I know is that up into the '70s there was a lip inside the intake and the water neck was flat.

While on some later ones the neck has the grooved lip and the intake face is flat. I assume the two shouldn't be mixed but it might not matter. No big deal really I guess its just safe to call them early or later made ones.
Yes but the date is the one i posted
 
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