Stock 289 Head Upgrades

12953 Views 82 Replies 21 Participants Last post by patrickstapler, Apr 10, 2021

Mikebrown7017

Discussion Starter · Apr 5, 2021

Looking for suggestions on upgrades please.
(and apologies - i know this question will have been asked several times in similar fashion)

I have a fairly stock 289, which is still getting hot on the passenger side. I've got the citric acid flush left to try, but pretty sure i've narrowed it down to being related just to that head (whether the passages are all blocked up or something). Judging by the oil condition when i got the car, i dont think the PO was that into changing fluids. :/

Oil pressure is also quite low when hot - at idle, the needle is barely lifted off the stop. It's about 1/4 way up the gauge when cruising, and 3/4 of the gauge when cold and first started.

So, im thinking some worn bearing shells probably cause of this. No knocking, but thinking still due a rebuild. Also, get a reasonable amount of breathing out the rocker cover filter.

So, thoughts while i'm at it, is that maybe just replacing the heads is the way to go.

Current specs are:
Stock 289, with Edelbrock Performer intake, and Edelbrock AVS2 500 CFM carb. "High rev" hydraulic lifters, uprated springs (inner & outer), new Cloyes timing set, and changed the cam (which was meant to be a Performer, but got something different - but is about 1-2 levels above stock). Standard exhaust headers, with 2" dual exhaust. Stock C4 trans, and stock rear axle/diff.

Not after anything too fancy - just street use for a bit of fun, and a bit more noise/choppier idle.

After suggestions, please, for suggested mods? I.e. new heads (or should i just strip and completely refurb my stock heads?), plus cam (i'm not against changing this again), and others?
I'm allowing for crank grind, new bearing shells, cylinder bore hone (probably), and set of rings (hopefully dont need new pistons), new oil pump. Would i need new push rods?
And ideally, i guess i should change stock headers (and hopefully could just change the headers and adapt my current dual exhaust to mate up to the new ones).

Probably budgeting around 2500. I know heads would eat quite a lot of this, hence the question about refurbing current heads. But if i'm wasting my time doing anything else until the heads are changed, then maybe budget needs to increase a bit..

Any thoughts/suggestions greatly appreciated.

Many thanks in advance.

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JEFFinOC

· #41 · Apr 7, 2021

Here’s the other thing... I’ve read a BUNCH of posts on this here forum about how a novice can easily make the heads flow worse if you screw up the porting job.

So how much would it suck to spend $700-800 to ‘do it right’ as stated above with the correct parts and process, and then ‘you’ go to do your home porting job and screw the whole thing up.

There’s a lot on my car that my boys and I have choosen the more manual long way to do. But I’ve read enough posts here to know that I’ll be investing in a set of aluminum heads when the time comes.

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KD Blue

· #42 · Apr 7, 2021

66coupe289 said:
I have a nice set of gasket matched and blended '65 heads...sitting on my shelf. I found a nice set of AFR 165's that had been milled to get the chambers down to 54cc. Did I need to do it? No. Does it make a difference? Yes, and it is significant. What's the logic to having more allegiance to keeping an iron set of heads than keeping an iron intake or exhaust manifolds? Intake and exhaust manifolds are the first things most people change to improve performance. Could my '65s be made to flow as well as the AFRs? Maybe, but not for the same money I have in the AFRs and removing 60# from the front end is a nice bonus. To each his own.

I suppose I have the same nostalgic like for a 289 as people do for iron heads. Yes there are better power options over a 289 by adding more stroke, but there is a certain satisfaction surprising people with it's performance.

I agree with you, wholeheartedly!
Anyone making decisions has to weigh the options readily available.
Sure, if someone already has a set of aluminum heads, sitting in one's garage, it's almost a no brainer decision to use them over a set of ported iron heads.
BUT, take away the aluminum head option and determining what U want from the engine, U then have to decide, do I buy a set of aluminum heads, just because everybody says that's the "cure-all" way to go, or do U come to a conclusion that 350 horse power is all U actually need!?
I know I have about 330 to 350 horse power coming outa my 289. Would I like more? Ya!
Do I need more to get from point A to point Z, NOPE! Is it worth the money to go get and install a 550 horse 408? NOPE! Especially when I weigh the 38 years of perfect performance from what I already have, to the additional power I'd use, only on occasion, TO SHOW OFF! I never intended to build a race car, so I built it my way.
Anyone wanting to spend big bucks on race parts, for a street application, BE MY GUEST!
Anybody that wants to save a few bucks by porting or moderately re-working a set of iron heads, can be my guest also!
Just remember, APPLICATION and CHOICE is anybody's option! 😏

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KD Blue

· #43 · Apr 8, 2021

JEFFinOC said:
Here’s the other thing... I’ve read a BUNCH of posts on this here forum about how a novice can easily make the heads flow worse if you screw up the porting job.

So how much would it suck to spend $700-800 to ‘do it right’ as stated above with the correct parts and process, and then ‘you’ go to do your home porting job and screw the whole thing up.

There’s a lot on my car that my boys and I have choosen the more manual long way to do. But I’ve read enough posts here to know that I’ll be investing in a set of aluminum heads when the time comes.

Again, it all depends on application and what U want/expect out of the car!
Just remember, adding better flowing aluminum heads to a rather stock engine, would be over kill! Little benefit from your investment would be realized. So, be ready to invest in basically re-doing your entire engine from the ground up! But, ask yourself, is it worth it, do I need it, can I afford it, do I really need 400 to 500+ horsepower to get where I want to go! A nice driver doesn't have to be a race car in disguise! And ya, U can have significant fun with 300 to 400 horse power. Even a stock, 225 horse 289 can get U in trouble! 😏

sportsroof69

· #44 · Apr 8, 2021

I’m not sure what anyone is “curing” with aftermarket heads. Stock SBF heads aren’t good, and are very limiting for anyone wanting modern car power. Aftermarket heads don’t “cure” anything, but they have a significant potential to make considerably more power than stock heads.

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patrickstapler

· #45 · Apr 8, 2021

Unless of course you are building for a specific vintage class...then it makes all the since in the world. You can build very good power with SBF iron heads...albeit, it will likely cost you more money.

Nailbender

· #46 · Apr 8, 2021

sportsroof69 said:
I’m not sure what anyone is “curing” with aftermarket heads. Stock SBF heads aren’t good, and are very limiting for anyone wanting modern car power. Aftermarket heads don’t “cure” anything, but they have a significant potential to make considerably more power than stock heads.

We agree, for once!

Nailbender

· #47 · Apr 8, 2021

patrickstapler said:
Unless of course you are building for a specific vintage class...then it makes all the since in the world. You can build very good power with SBF iron heads...albeit, it will likely cost you more money.

!00% true, but you guys tend to have a little more fun money compared to most of us. Thats not a bad thing, but still a thing when it comes time to spending money wisely.

sportsroof69

· #48 · Apr 8, 2021

patrickstapler said:
Unless of course you are building for a specific vintage class...then it makes all the since in the world. You can build very good power with SBF iron heads...albeit, it will likely cost you more money.

True, but very good power is subjective. In most cases here, we aren’t talking about building something for a specific class.

patrickstapler

· #49 · Apr 8, 2021

Hell I live check to check. If my kids want my money they better come to the track with me. I’m tracking my balance to be at $0.00 when I cash out...of course barring some tragedy. Then there’s cool $1M at stake. Won’t be my problem then. I earn it...by damn I’m spending it...on myself and Holly.

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Nailbender

· #50 · Apr 8, 2021

patrickstapler said:
Hell I live check to check. If my kids want my money they better come to the track with me. I’m tracking my balance to be at $0.00 when I cash out...of course barring some tragedy. Then there’s cool $1M at stake. Won’t be my problem then. I earn it...by damn I’m spending it...on myself and Holly.

Hell yea! I don't live paycheck to paycheck. Then again I don't do track days!

KD Blue

· #51 · Apr 8, 2021

sportsroof69 said:
I’m not sure what anyone is “curing” with aftermarket heads. Stock SBF heads aren’t good, and are very limiting for anyone wanting modern car power. Aftermarket heads don’t “cure” anything, but they have a significant potential to make considerably more power than stock heads.

"CURING" is a figure of speach!
And not everyone is looking for "modern day power!"
As far as I'm concerned, this current horse power race has gotten way outa hand.
Sooner or later, governments of the world will impose restrictions on what's considered "streetable", common sense, horse power!
There is a place for common transportation and there is a place for what's considered a race car!
It's gotten a bit ridiculas, considering a vehicle with 200 horse power will get U anywhere a vehicle with 800+ horse power will!
In other words, there is more to a nice driver vehicle, than mega horsepower and lightening like speed!
That's the point I'm talking about! 🤔

Nailbender

· #52 · Apr 8, 2021 (Edited)

KD Blue said:
"CURING" is a figure of speach!
And not everyone is looking for "modern day power!"
As far as I'm concerned, this current horse power race has gotten way outa hand.
Sooner or later, governments of the world will impose restrictions on what's considered "streetable", common sense, horse power!
There is a place for common transportation and there is a place for what's considered a race car!
It's gotten a bit ridiculas, considering a vehicle with 200 horse power will get U anywhere a vehicle with 800+ horse power will!
In other words, there is more to a nice driver vehicle, than mega horsepower and lightening like speed!
That's the point I'm talking about! 🤔

So the government should regulate how much fun is acceptable? Awesome, try the Prius forum!

Reactions: 1

sportsroof69

· #53 · Apr 8, 2021

KD Blue said:
"CURING" is a figure of speach!
And not everyone is looking for "modern day power!"
As far as I'm concerned, this current horse power race has gotten way outa hand.
Sooner or later, governments of the world will impose restrictions on what's considered "streetable", common sense, horse power!
There is a place for common transportation and there is a place for what's considered a race car!
It's gotten a bit ridiculas, considering a vehicle with 200 horse power will get U anywhere a vehicle with 800+ horse power will!
In other words, there is more to a nice driver vehicle, than mega horsepower and lightening like speed!
That's the point I'm talking about! 🤔

well that’s one persons opinion. Others may vary.

KD Blue

· #54 · Apr 8, 2021

sportsroof69 said:
I’m not sure what anyone is “curing” with aftermarket heads. Stock SBF heads aren’t good, and are very limiting for anyone wanting modern car power. Aftermarket heads don’t “cure” anything, but they have a significant potential to make considerably more power than stock heads.

I agree in general!
BUT YOU GUYS ARE CLUELESS AS TO WHAT I'M TRYING TO GET ACROSS TO U!
Horsepower costs money!
If U guys wanna build race engines for an every-day driver application, be my guest!
When 350 horsepower will be sufficient, why use 550+???
We're not all "speed demons", ya know! 😎
If I wanna see "smoke shows", I'll go to the drags! I'm really not that impressed with 100 yard burn outs these days! 🤔

sportsroof69

· #55 · Apr 8, 2021 (Edited)

KD Blue said:
I agree in general!
BUT YOU GUYS ARE CLUELESS AS TO WHAT I'M TRYING TO GET ACROSS TO U!
Horsepower costs money!
If U guys wanna build race engines for an every-day driver application, be my guest!
When 350 horsepower will be sufficient, why use 550+???
We're not all "speed demons", ya know! 😎
If I wanna see "smoke shows", I'll go to the drags! I'm really not that impressed with 100 yard burn outs these days! 🤔

But this isn’t your engine. It’s not up to you to decide what other people want, or need. And here’s another secret. Most people aren’t building their cars to impress you. Personally, I don’t really care what impresses you, when I’m building my vehicles.

KD Blue

· #56 · Apr 8, 2021

Nailbender said:
So the government should regulate how much fun is acceptable? Awesome! Man are you on the wrong forum!

Ya, I'm beginning to think so! The people on here, with exception of a few others, are infatuated with speed and horsepower! Many of U guys never knew what common sense ever was! THAT WAS LOST SOMEWHERE, YEARS AGO!
BY ALL MEANS, GO AHEAD, BE STUPID AND BLOW YOUR HARD EARNED MONEY , on stuff U don't need!
After all, U'll all hold individual records on cash out-flow! Congrats, It's great for bragging rights anyway!

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sportsroof69

· #57 · Apr 8, 2021

KD Blue said:
Ya, I'm beginning to think so! The people on here, with exception of a few others, are infatuated with speed and horsepower! Many of U guys never knew what common sense ever was! THAT WAS LOST SOMEWHERE, YEARS AGO!
BY ALL MEANS, GO AHEAD, BE STUPID AND BLOW YOUR HARD EARNED MONEY , on stuff U don't need!
After all, U'll all hold individual records on cash out-flow! Congrats, It's great for bragging rights anyway!

😂 wow

Reactions: 1

KD Blue

· #58 · Apr 8, 2021

sportsroof69 said:
But this isn’t your engine. It’s not up to you to decide what other people want, or need. And here’s another secret. Most people aren’t building their cars to impress you. Personally, I don’t really care what impresses you, when I’m building my vehicles.

...and I don't care if U want to continue talking stupid either!
Buddy, U R CLUELESS as to my intentions here! 🤔

Nailbender

· #59 · Apr 8, 2021

KD Blue said:
Ya, I'm beginning to think so! The people on here, with exception of a few others, are infatuated with speed and horsepower! Many of U guys never knew what common sense ever was! THAT WAS LOST SOMEWHERE, YEARS AGO!
BY ALL MEANS, GO AHEAD, BE STUPID AND BLOW YOUR HARD EARNED MONEY , on stuff U don't need!
After all, U'll all hold individual records on cash out-flow! Congrats, It's great for bragging rights anyway!

Go big or go home! If I need ice cream we will take the wife's Flex.

Reactions: 1

sportsroof69

· #60 · Apr 8, 2021

KD Blue said:
...and I don't care if U want to continue talking stupid either!
Buddy, U R CLUELESS as to my intentions here! 🤔

Sure. Roger that 👍

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