@thatgreen66yote Coyote Swap Thread

25626 Views 455 Replies 27 Participants Last post by 602Raptor, 15 d ago

Anangryford

Discussion Starter · Jan 7, 2022 (Edited)

Starting a build thread for the first time to document progress and get advise from the many on here who have dealt with the issues posed by this swap. My car has the second generation MII Heidts front end in it with an SBF and a t5 right now. Fueling is from tanks inc injection tank and Pimpxs. I mini tubbed it and installed an SoT 3 link, 9" with 3.89's and truetrac last year. Here in the planned parts list as of now.

Gen 3 mustang coyote(new or used not sure yet)

Vintage air front runner(not sure if I will be running a driven PS pump or Volvo electric)

T56 wide ratio with QT bell, 1330 yoke, clutch fork (will be here next week)

Running a cable for the clutch right now since I already have it. May go to hydraulic if the pedal is too stiff.

Ford control pack

Flywheel

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Clutch

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Ford Performance Mustang Organic Clutch Kit; 26 Spline M-7560-T46 (96-04 V8 Mustang w/ Tremec Transmission) - Free Shipping

FREE SHIPPING! Enhances Overall Performance. If you want to add more power to your already impressive Ford Mustang V8, then the Ford Performance Clutch is your

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Pilot

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Ford Performance Mustang Roller Pilot Bearing M-7600-B (96-17 Mustang GT; 07-12 Mustang GT500) - Free Shipping

FREE SHIPPING! Extra Insurance. To extend the life of your Mustangs new performance clutch it is highly recommended to replace that old and worn out stock pilot

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Trans tunnel

1965-1973 Mustang Transmission Tunnel Panel

Parts for Engine-Transmission Swaps & Chassis Upgrades

www.tinmanfabrication.com

Driveshaft will be Sot

Will run Manual brake's for now. Probably wilwood MC

Headers are TBD

Oil cooler nonsense is TBD

Radiator and fan are TBD

Seems daunting. Here is the car as it sits:

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Anangryford

Discussion Starter · #41 · Feb 17, 2022 (Edited)

Did some stripping over the last couple days

. Also had my motor mounts and a driver side header come in. The motor mounts are from welder series out of Canada. They look nice. Since I'm welding the other side to the cradle I can position the engine wherever I want taking in to account header space, radiator space, cradle clearance, and how much I need to cut the tunnel. As for the header, it appears to be smaller diameter tubing than the one that came on the crate engine so I'm not sure I will be able to use is. More on that later. For now I need to move the firewall back where @Huntingky did, remove the trans crossmember, and remove the filler panels in the engine bay and make them bolt in(helps with header installation).

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602Raptor

· #42 · Feb 17, 2022

How are you doing the stripping and what are your plans for a finish? Will you be adding any additional bracing?

Anangryford

Discussion Starter · #43 · Feb 17, 2022

602Raptor said:
How are you doing the stripping and what are your plans for a finish? Will you be adding any additional bracing?

4" wire wheel on a grinder. Semi gloss black. I will be adding bracing similar to the MTF setup except I will weld a plate to the pinch welds on the firewall and have the tubing hug where the shock towers were so lugs can be added to tie it in under the hood and to the cowl.

Reactions: 1

Kjsmitty

· #44 · Feb 17, 2022 (Edited)

Looking good Angry,
Being able to manipulate where ”you” want the engine will be nice (via motor mounts). Tunnel considerations are a given but definitely be thinking PS (if not electric) or Alternator if placing it in the lower front drivers side, MC to valve cover clearance as well as your desired steering linkage etc. I’ve added a picture of my firewall for an example. Once I removed the humps not to mention with all the other holes, and the fact I was slightly tilting my MC as well as moved it left about 1/2 inch along with the lower steering column, it was just easier to cover the entire firewall. I used a single sheet of 16 gauge for extra strength, stitch welded it in all the way around as well as numerous spot welds through existing structure - from the back side. Besides all of the required structure behind the MC mount it was quite easy.

Top photo is where I started cutting drilling and prepping. I then went on to fabricating the internal MC structure.
(I have no comments on where that 1970s pink shag rug came from, or why I had it….)🤓
Bottom photo is after initial primer at the body shop.

Fun, fun.

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Anangryford

Discussion Starter · #45 · Feb 17, 2022

Kjsmitty said:
Looking good Angry,
Being able to manipulate where ”you” want the engine will be nice (via motor mounts). Tunnel considerations are a given but definitely be thinking PS (if not electric) or Alternator if placing it in the lower front drivers side, MC to valve cover clearance as well as your desired steering linkage etc. I’ve added a picture of my firewall for an example. Once I removed the humps not to mention with all the other holes, and the fact I was slightly tilting my MC as well as moved it left about 1/2 inch along with the lower steering column, it was just easier to cover the entire firewall. I used a single sheet of 16 gauge for extra strength, stitch welded it in all the way around as well as numerous spot welds through existing structure - from the back side. Besides all of the required structure behind the MC mount it was quite easy.

Top photo is where I started cutting drilling and prepping. I then went on to fabricating the internal MC structure.
(I have no comments on where that 1970s pink shag rug came from, or why I had it….)🤓
Bottom photo is after initial primer at the body shop.

Fun, fun.

View attachment 829955
View attachment 829957

Wow that looks nice.

Huntingky

· #46 · Feb 17, 2022

Anangryford said:
Also had my motor mounts and a driver side header come in. As for the header, it appears to be smaller diameter tubing than the one that came on the crate engine so I'm not sure I will be able to use is. More on that later.

View attachment 829945
View attachment 829951 UOTE]
I had some concerns about the header sizes myself but I measured and it appeared to be just material and construction. Checked with a couple of Ford distributors and it appears they were built to same basic specs, just changed manufacturers. To get the newest manufacturer, you have to buy the one with the catalytic attached. On the passenger side, old and new had to same part number. I was going to run the old simply for visual, not that you can really see anything once it is in there.

Reactions: 1

Anangryford

Discussion Starter · #47 · Feb 17, 2022

Kjsmitty said:
Looking good Angry,
Being able to manipulate where ”you” want the engine will be nice (via motor mounts). Tunnel considerations are a given but definitely be thinking PS (if not electric) or Alternator if placing it in the lower front drivers side, MC to valve cover clearance as well as your desired steering linkage etc. I’ve added a picture of my firewall for an example. Once I removed the humps not to mention with all the other holes, and the fact I was slightly tilting my MC as well as moved it left about 1/2 inch along with the lower steering column, it was just easier to cover the entire firewall. I used a single sheet of 16 gauge for extra strength, stitch welded it in all the way around as well as numerous spot welds through existing structure - from the back side. Besides all of the required structure behind the MC mount it was quite easy.

Top photo is where I started cutting drilling and prepping. I then went on to fabricating the internal MC structure.
(I have no comments on where that 1970s pink shag rug came from, or why I had it….)🤓
Bottom photo is after initial primer at the body shop.

Fun, fun.

View attachment 829955
View attachment 829957

What does your AC install look like with those changes to the firewall?

Anangryford

Discussion Starter · #48 · Feb 17, 2022

When the time finally comes to test fit the engine I may try to make them fit. Seems likely I will end up doing what you did and spend the $1500. Looks like your headers will play well with a cable clutch. How is your clearance for steering?

Kjsmitty

· #49 · Feb 17, 2022 (Edited)

Anangryford said:
What does your AC install look like with those changes to the firewall?

In all reality the flat firewall made the AC install easier. Actually I wouldn call it easier because that would imply the intended way was harder.. I’ll just say everything went great. I went with the Vintage Air setup. Now, full disclosure I had ordered the full 65 Mustang instal kit. Ironically it arrived prior to me deciding on a Coyote swap…. I have nothing but good to say about Vintage Air - even though I had their full kit for numerous years they took back near every piece of the kit that I did not use due to the swap. Everything was like new however, but still, they refunded me for each piece near 5 years later…. SO, if you haven’t already, plan to order whatever brand you go with A-La-Carte. You will likely change your mind on plumbing direction along the way (no way, never happened to me….. 😜).

Anyway, if you go with the Vintage all I did was modified the under dash unit brackets to mount to a flush/flat firewall. As you have seen with many here, one of the best routes is to plumb everything within the passenger fender well. On my firewall picture above, the two larger holes in the lower center are for my heater hoses. I used AN style pass-through fittings. The two smaller holes, one near center and the other off to the left are the two mounting holes for the under dash assembly. (The large oval hole on the left inner fender panel next to the firewall is for the two engine management wiring harnesses).
There are three mounts on the vintage air. One on the front top which didn’t change, the other two on the back. The left one I just straightened out then bent flat - basically shortened it and placed the “bolt hole“ where I could get at it. The right one I did similar however also added to it to facilitate the input side heat valve install. It was just one other item I did not want to have under the hood. Given my heater hose routing that was also my only choice short of having it behind the engine down near the tunnel.
In the third picture you can see my AC plumbing (My ego insists that I point out the zip ties were just temporary.. 😜)
The two capped fittings are for the dryer which I fabricated a custom mount that utilizes the fender mounting holes/bolts behind the headlight bucket.

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Anangryford

Discussion Starter · #50 · Feb 17, 2022

Kjsmitty said:
In all reality the flat firewall made the AC install easier. Actually I wouldn call it easier because that would imply the intended way was harder.. I’ll just say everything went great. I went with the Vintage Air setup. Now, full disclosure I had ordered the full 65 Mustang instal kit. Ironically it arrived prior to me deciding on a Coyote swap…. I have nothing but good to say about Vintage Air - even though I had their full kit for numerous years they took back near every piece of the kit that I did not use due to the swap. Everything was like new however, but still, they refunded me for each piece near 5 years later…. SO, if you haven’t already, plan to order whatever brand you go with A-La-Carte. You will likely change your mind on plumbing direction along the way (no way, never happened to me….. 😜).

Anyway, if you go with the Vintage all I did was modified the under dash unit brackets to mount to a flush/flat firewall. As you have seen with many here, one of the best routes is to plumb everything within the passenger fender well. On my firewall picture above, the two larger holes in the lower center are for my heater hoses. I used AN style pass-through fittings. The two smaller holes, one near center and the other off to the left are the two mounting holes for the under dash assembly. (The large oval hole on the left inner fender panel next to the firewall is for the two engine management wiring harnesses).
There are three mounts on the vintage air. One on the front top which didn’t change, the other two on the back. The left one I just straightened out then bent flat - basically shortened it and placed the “bolt hole“ where I could get at it. The right one I did similar however also added to it to facilitate the input side heat valve install. It was just one other item I did not want to have under the hood. Given my heater hose routing that was also my only choice short of having it behind the engine down near the tunnel.
In the third picture you can see my AC plumbing (My ego insists that I point out the zip ties were just temporary.. 😜)
The two capped fittings are for the dryer which I fabricated a custom mount that utilizes the fender mounting holes/bolts behind the headlight bucket.

View attachment 829970
View attachment 829971
View attachment 829973

Looks really good. Did you mount a bypass for your heater hose anywhere? I have read its important for cooling in the head.

www.summitracing.com

Vintage Air 344470 Vintage Air Ford Coyote Heater Control Valve Bypass Fittings | Summit Racing

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Kjsmitty

· #51 · Feb 18, 2022

Thanks Angry,
Yes, the exact one you referenced. Mine is actually under the intake manifold
The first time I called Vintage Air after going the swap route it was one of the first things they recommended.

Your engine mounts look well made -nice welds

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Anangryford

Discussion Starter · #52 · Feb 19, 2022

Couldn’t help myself.

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Kjsmitty

· #53 · Feb 19, 2022

If you’re good you’ll have it running by Monday….. 😆

So what’s your thoughts with that placement - was that with the engine mounts on and contacting the crossmember?
Are you planning on using the Gen-III oil pan? It actually appears to fit better than I thought. Another key item to start digesting will be your brake MC fitment.
shave that firewall.. 😄👍

Anangryford

Discussion Starter · #54 · Feb 19, 2022

Kjsmitty said:
If you’re good you’ll have it running by Monday….. 😆

So what’s your thoughts with that placement - was that with the engine mounts on and contacting the crossmember?
Are you planning on using the Gen-III oil pan? It actually appears to fit better than I thought. Another key item to start digesting will be your brake MC fitment.
shave that firewall.. 😄👍

Lol. Hoping to fire it up by New Years.
Looks okay for placement. That was with 1/2”-3/4” clearance with the steering rack and the oil pan level with the bottom of the cross member.
I am planning on running the stock oil pan.
MC is going to be a problem.

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I cut the entirety of the first hump off the firewall. We will see how much further I go. I can’t really move the engine any further back anyway.

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Anangryford

Discussion Starter · #55 · Feb 19, 2022

Mounts are tacked. it’s about as low as I can go.

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Intake doesn’t fit and the CMCV is in the way of course. In the pic the back of the intake is 1.25” from being seated where it belongs. Notch the cowl or move the engine forward are my 2 choices. What do you guys think?

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Kjsmitty

· #56 · Feb 19, 2022 (Edited)

Greetings Angry,
So, when you say your intake is 1.25 inch from seating are you saying it’s just 1.25 directly above where it sits, or it needs to go back 1.25 more towards the firewall?
I added a couple photos for example of where my valves sit. You can see where I actually removed the firewall upper pinch weld to make more space. My engine mounts were fixed so no up, down or forward for me.
What would keep you from coming forward and/or down some? Strictly oil pan?
-Im thinking your cross member position will allow you to lower the front end more than I can (something I would have liked - about .5 or 1 inch lower). However desired, that also places the engine higher. Always a trade off.
-Depending on your headers/exhaust, brake MC and definitely mock up your column to rack steering linkage to see what you may “need” to do etc. A low profile oil pan may be a required option. Don’t get me wrong, I would want to use the composite one as well.

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Anangryford

Discussion Starter · #57 · Feb 19, 2022

Kjsmitty said:
Greetings Angry,
So, when you say your intake is 1.25 inch from seating are you saying it’s just 1.25 directly above where it sits, or it needs to go back 1.25 more towards the firewall?
I added a couple photos for example of where my valves sit. You can see where I actually removed the firewall upper pinch weld to make more space. My engine mounts were fixed so no up, down or forward for me.
What would keep you from coming forward and/or down some? Strictly oil pan?
-Im thinking your cross member position will allow you to lower the front end more than I can (something I would have liked - about .5 or 1 inch lower). However desired, that also places the engine higher. Always a trade off.
-Depending on your headers/exhaust, brake MC and definitely mock up your column to rack steering linkage to see what you may “need” to do etc. A low profile oil pan may be a required option. Don’t get me wrong, I would want to use the composite one as well.
View attachment 830279 View attachment 830280 View attachment 830278

1.25” from seating and maybe 1/4” back but not much. I’m not aware of an aftermarket pan for the 3rd gen. My crossmember is a bit of a factor but it could be notched. Steering rack is about 3/8” clearance and I don’t want to go any closer. Judging by the engine position I will either need to move my master cylinder up or do an under dash set up. I don’t have headers that fit yet so I can’t really judge that. On a side note, look what you made me do😂

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Kjsmitty

· #58 · Feb 20, 2022

👍. And it’s so much easier to work on the dash wiring harness….. 😜

On the passenger side of the cowl you can just make relief cuts in what’s remaining and hammer and dolly it flat - but I bet you're already thinking that.

Copy on the Gen-3 pan. I hadn’t thought that it would be different than a Gen-2.

So what would happen if you just swapped your engine mounts in the above photo from left to right? Looks like it may move the engine forward a 1/2 inch or so - would the pan still clear the crossmember? Having what ever space you can get behind the engine will prove handy with both running the wiring harness and/or future maintenance etc.
On that note, if I had to do it over again I would of installed and finalized the engine harness prior to installing the engine. All of the wiring / harness heat protection etc I had to do behind the engine after instal was a royal PITA.

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Anangryford

Discussion Starter · #59 · Feb 20, 2022

Kjsmitty said:
👍. And it’s so much easier to work on the dash wiring harness….. 😜

On the passenger side of the cowl you can just make relief cuts in what’s remaining and hammer and dolly it flat - but I bet you're already thinking that.

Copy on the Gen-3 pan. I hadn’t thought that it would be different than a Gen-2.

So what would happen if you just swapped your engine mounts in the above photo from left to right? Looks like it may move the engine forward a 1/2 inch or so - would the pan still clear the crossmember? Having what ever space you can get behind the engine will prove handy with both running the wiring harness and/or future maintenance etc.
On that note, if I had to do it over again I would of installed and finalized the engine harness prior to installing the engine. All of the wiring / harness heat protection etc I had to do behind the engine after instal was a royal PITA.

I could flip the mounts or just cut the tacks and move it wherever I want. There is a rib that would hit the crossmember but I can notch that. I put it back a bit so I would have more space in the engine compartment. How much space do you have between the firewall and the back of your block where your trans mounts?

Kjsmitty

· #60 · Feb 21, 2022

Anangryford said:
How much space do you have between the firewall and the back of your block where your trans mounts?

From the closest part of the passenger head to shaved firewall I have between 3.25 and 3.5 inches. It appears that is pretty close to the rear block area where it meets the bell housing etc. So with the intake off the closest portion of the engine to firewall is the ~3.25+ inches. With intake the furthest back CMCV is only 1.25 maybe 1.5 inches from shaved firewall.
Your engine does appear to be at least 1.5 inches higher than mine.
-My Master Cylinder placement was probably the most challenging little mod to the firewall. That was one of the items I had purchased several years prior thus was pretty much stuck using it. Along with the hydraulic clutch items. I knew I just had to make it work.

Say, have you seen the “Mal Wood” 65 + Mustang hydraulic clutch/pedal assembly. If I have issues with my current MDL setup I’ll be using one of theirs.. If that would of been available a couple years ago I would of been all over it then as well.

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