Vintage Mustang Forums banner

1 - 20 of 65 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
210 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Thought i would run this by the community. Took wifes 69 to get alignment after her new wheels and tires.

Immediately after they wwre put on the drivers side tire, when turned all the way to the right, hit the front bottom part of wheel well in fender. Passenger side has always been fine.

Took to shop, the wheel was adjusted negative so it could be driven. Went to get alignment 2 days ago, and guy spent 6 to 7 hrs and gave it back to me in essentially rhe same position. It is all over the road and needs to be chased. He said initially that he thought maybe it was hit snd front end was twisted a bit. I called frame guy and he went over to the shop whild it was on lift and he checked it out. He said it wasnt hit, but it almost looked like the upper control arm on Driver side was messed with and cut snd welded or something.

We have already replaced both lower ball joints and upper, snd lower control arms and wheel bearings. All new. Now the shop is telling me to install adjustable upper control arms and this should solve.

I am going to go to a second shop today and get another opinion and this shop i have gone to a couple times for same thing.

Does anyone else have a feel or suggestion? A place i spoke to yesterday sounded much more confident in that car and I am hoping he can see it today. Not sure tho.

Has anyone else had this issue? The driver side hss been adjusted all over the place to try to make it right.

Curious before I invest and spend more money if an adjustable upper control arm will solve it.

The drive side wheel was definitely more forward in the wheel well than passenger. Always has been since we got it.

Thanks
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
35,512 Posts
Remember that besides the wheel alignment positioning the wheel & tire in the wheel opening that the fender can also be moved forward and back a significant amount. What does the gap at the rear top of the fender to cowl/windshield look like?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,289 Posts
Yes common issue with alignment shops. They struggle with these cars. Many don’t know what to do. You could solve problem with expensive upper a arm replacement to an adjustable. Lots of time and money. You could also get adjustable strut rods. Still expensive, but solves the problem. Or you can be cheap like me, and use a few shims on front bolt of upper A arm like on the early 65-66 cars to bring that spindle back into center of wheel well. Then buy a longacre gauge and do the alignment yourself. If you don’t want to do alignment yourself, then at least find a new shop.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,138 Posts
Id inquire with a restoration shop.
Even if they do chevys they will know who to send you to.

About 7 yrs ago i had a chain try to align my 08 fusion
They couldn't do it and insisted my frame was bent. Went on and on went back and forth . Finally called the main office and got my money back.

Took it to a competent shop and they made it perfect in a half hour.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,557 Posts
That tire/wheel 215/65/15 should fit. Couple of thoughts... the strut rod adjustment determines the wheel position so I would start with new strut rod bushings. I am guessing you have the original, undamaged, OE strut rods ? Check to see if the fender OE forward fender/valance brace is in place ? Alignment shops have a reputation for doing exactly what's happening to you. See below for the 69 Shop Manual alignment specs and a copy of the specs for my 69. Spec's are for 14" wheels
763150
763151
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
210 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Ok, so i took some pics, and I think I had mentioned in a different post that the fender was off. The driver side fender is aboutnhalf inch further back than passenger. However, originally, a half inch was not going to make it clear we didnt think so we adjusted the strut rods back as mentioned.

Yes i do believe this has the adjustable strut rods as the previous shop said they adjusted them back so wheel could be centered more.

I am at work, but can take more pics and investigate whatever you guys need me to when i get home in a few hrs.

Here are some pics.

Thanks for the help.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,336 Posts
Unless something is bent an alignment shop knowledgable about classics should be able to get it right. No need getting an adjustable arm unless you want one. The rub is finding the shop. No pun intended. We’ve got one here and a couple locations of a local chain that can do it. Most shops here won’t take it because the specs aren’t in the computer.

+1 checking with local restoration shops or mechanics in your area that work on classics.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,724 Posts
Take the driver's side tire off and get some good pics of the upper control arm and shock tower. If the frame guy says something looks off, let's see what he's talking about.
 
  • Like
Reactions: j persons

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,557 Posts
69 Shop Manual diagram that may help move the conversation along ?
763157
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
210 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
Ok, will do.
Will take tire off and get some pics for you all to see.

What is the thought on the fender? Does it need to be adjusted or should that not make that big of a difference?

I have a little longer day today and a shorter one yomorrow, so either this evening or tomorrow afternoon after work. I work weekends.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,037 Posts
Bishop, left front fender should move forward abit. Don't know if that will be enough to help you or not. And your splash pan looks like it may be bent. Show us a picture of the upper arms when you can. Welded upper arms can SOMETIMES be the result of someone modifying them to live with greater than 1 inch Arning style drops. LSG
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
210 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
Ok I am gonna get those pics asap.

I was considering mpving the fender a bit, but that will be a project correct? A lot of stuff needs to come off if i am right,in order to move that fender up half an inch?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,557 Posts
Probably leave the fender alone for now. Something is wrong with the lower control arm position. Why it is where it is needs to be determined. Hard to believe the shock tower or the upper arm is the reason but until you can get some eyes on that area you just won't know. As mentioned; previous damage and off the wall repairs with who knows what parts or just an inept alignment shop are all real possibilities. You should have at least 2" clear in front of that left/front tire. Just my opinion. Brian
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1 Posts
Thought i would run this by the community. Took wifes 69 to get alignment after her new wheels and tires.

Immediately after they wwre put on the drivers side tire, when turned all the way to the right, hit the front bottom part of wheel well in fender. Passenger side has always been fine.

Took to shop, the wheel was adjusted negative so it could be driven. Went to get alignment 2 days ago, and guy spent 6 to 7 hrs and gave it back to me in essentially rhe same position. It is all over the road and needs to be chased. He said initially that he thought maybe it was hit snd front end was twisted a bit. I called frame guy and he went over to the shop whild it was on lift and he checked it out. He said it wasnt hit, but it almost looked like the upper control arm on Driver side was messed with and cut snd welded or something.

We have already replaced both lower ball joints and upper, snd lower control arms and wheel bearings. All new. Now the shop is telling me to install adjustable upper control arms and this should solve.

I am going to go to a second shop today and get another opinion and this shop i have gone to a couple times for same thing.

Does anyone else have a feel or suggestion? A place i spoke to yesterday sounded much more confident in that car and I am hoping he can see it today. Not sure tho.

Has anyone else had this issue? The driver side has been adjusted all over the place to try to make it right.

Curious before I invest and spend more money if an adjustable upper control arm will solve it.

The drive side wheel was definitely more forward in the wheel well than passenger. Always has been since we got it.

Thanks
Ive restored these cars a few times and alignment of panels is a royal PIA including the alignment of the front end. Just by the pics its out quite a bit body wise. Suspension wise without looking at the first reading and the end adjustments im shooting in the dark. I'd first look at where the wheel is sitting in relation to the fender in its current position. Is it Center? Is it forward or back in relation to the centerline of the fender. That gives clues on what to do next. Suspension geometry isnt to complicated on those cars. From the factory they are shimmed with negative camber to compensate for the front end weight on the car and Im suspecting the cause is due to that and too much toe. I'd also be checking to make sure the idler arm and pitman arm are in the correct position as this can throw it out as well. If it took 6 hours to align it then something isnt right.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
10,881 Posts
Ok, so i took some pics, and I think I had mentioned in a different post that the fender was off. The driver side fender is aboutnhalf inch further back than passenger. However, originally, a half inch was not going to make it clear we didnt think so we adjusted the strut rods back as mentioned.

Yes i do believe this has the adjustable strut rods as the previous shop said they adjusted them back so wheel could be centered more.

I am at work, but can take more pics and investigate whatever you guys need me to when i get home in a few hrs.

Here are some pics.

Thanks for the help.
"ALL" 67-73 mustangs came from the factory with "adjustable" strut rods. There were never any non adjustable strut rods on a 67-73. 65-66 are the only years with non adjustable strut rods. I use to work as a mechanic in the 70's. 67-73 mustangs are one of the easiest cars to align.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
246 Posts
From a body panel alignment standpoint, both fenders look about right where they meet the lower windshield molding. Is the left fender original or is it some aftermarket repro? I suggest carefully measuring each fender front to back to see if the problem isn't the fender itself. From your pics, it appears the gap between the back edge of the hood and the cowl is too big. Get the hood adjusted to fit the cowl better and then check/adjust the fender alignment relative to the hood. There may some improvement there.

Typically caster (adjusting the strut rods on a '69) can open up the gap between the fender and the tire. In any event, with all the messing around with wheel alignment, I suspect there are a number of adjustments that are just FUBAR'D, starting with centering the steering box/steering wheel. The correct position is when the number of turns from center to full left is equal to the number of turns from center to full right.. Good luck and let us know how it turns out.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,594 Posts
It also looks like the lower valence is bent upwards. Possibly from the tire rubbing it, it maybe it’s just tweaked some Or missing a bracket. Here’s a 235/60 on a 7 inch with 3.75 backspacing. No rubbing.
763216
 
1 - 20 of 65 Posts
Top