Vintage Mustang Forums banner

1 - 20 of 27 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
187 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hey, Guys,

As some of you know, I bought a '66 oupe last Saturday and noticed on the drive home, that it was pretty much of a hand full. It wants to constantly "wander"...not "pulling" either way, just spasmotically wandering to one side and/or the other. Also, I nothiced more "inside" wear on both front tires (more so on the driver's side than the other). I'm assuming this may be caused by too much negative camber, but I'm far from an expert in this area.
Anyone have thoughts/suggestions?
Thanks in advance......
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
590 Posts
Were the tires ever rotated... how about a shot of both tires from the front maybe they are toed out? I don't even know how you could accomplish too much negative camber at least I sure can't lol
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,998 Posts
Sounds like loose everything!! Check it all out, ball joints, tie rods, upper and lower control arms, idler arm bushing, steering box, wheel bearings, strut rods... You get the idea, right? That and a good alignment.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15 Posts
I had a problem with my 67 where the front tires were wearing on the insides also. Dont rermember if it wandered any but it turned out that the frame was cracked somewhere causing a "sag" in the suspension. sorry i can remember where exactly it was cracked (this was about 14 yrs ago) but you may want to take a close look for any structural cracks or splits in the front end. I had a body shop weld it up and that fixed my tire problem. PS. looks like you got road hugger tires..those were the same ones I had when i had my problem..hmm.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
120 Posts
I'd check the idler arm first.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
187 Posts
Discussion Starter #6 (Edited)
Were the tires ever rotated?
Sorry, I don't know...the car has been sitting for the past2 years at least.

I don't even know how you could accomplish too much negative camber at least I sure can't lol
Like I said, no expertise here. ???

I plan to at least rotate them tomorrow, btu that will only be a band aid...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Lack of sufficient toe in will cause a car to wander. Toe out will create a situation where the car turns easily, which sounds like your description of "spasmotically wandering".

If you have a good level surface and using a bubble level against a good flat portion of the front wheels you can get an idea on camber by placing the bubble level against the hub, if suitable, or across the rim from the top to the bottom. You can't use the rubber of the tire because the lower portion of the tire will be bowed out from the load of the car.

You can get an idea on toe-in or toe-out using the string method.

that's if you don't want to go to an alignment shop AND assuming you already checked all the suspension components and know the upper and lower control arm bushings are good, the steering box is ok, the idler arm is good, and both inner and outer tie rods are good.

Was the handling like this when the road was smooth or only when the road is bumpy? i.e. bump steer condition.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
187 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
already checked all the suspension components and know the upper and lower control arm bushings are good, the steering box is ok, the idler arm is good, and both inner and outer tie rods are good. Was the handling like this when the road was smooth or only when the road is bumpy? i.e. bump steer condition.
Forgot mention...I have checked the items you mentioned. I don't "think" it's bump steer because it happens on both types of surfaces.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Sorry, I don't know...the car has been sitting for the past2 years at least.



Like I said, no expertise here. ???

I plan to at least rotate them tomorrow, btu that will only be a band aid...
This wasn't on the board when I first saw this.

Since you say you have no experience, take it to a good mechanic for a front end alignment.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
187 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
Lack of sufficient toe in will cause a car to wander. Toe out will create a situation where the car turns easily, which sounds like your description of "spasmotically wandering".

If you have a good level surface and using a bubble level against a good flat portion of the front wheels you can get an idea on camber by placing the bubble level against the hub, if suitable, or across the rim from the top to the bottom. You can't use the rubber of the tire because the lower portion of the tire will be bowed out from the load of the car.
I plan to do that in a few minutes...thanks.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
571 Posts
I had a 67' that ate through tires like that about every six months until I found out that both of the shock towers were severely cracked and the whole front end was sagging. Hopefully that's not what you have, because it's not a cheap fix. As for the wandering down the road, my car does the same thing. I'm told it's because my caster is severely off, due to the car having been aligned with the old factory specs which are garbage for today's radial tires. Look up the effects of negative or insufficient caster, it's exactly what you describe. Get it aligned to the Shelby alignment specs and I bet it will help.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,487 Posts
X2 take it to a pro, and get an estimate.
If it's not a daily driver, and you have a good amount of automotive tools, you will find enough information on the forums here, to do a lot of the parts replacements, yourself.

Alternatively, join a local mustang/car club and they may be able to point you to someone reasonably priced and experinced in classic cars.
Good luck
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,334 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
571 Posts
Never mind...I found this. Is it what you were referring to?
No, I believe those are the factory specs you have there. You want the following specs:

Caster: +2.5
Camber: 0
Toe: 1/8"

These are the specs that opentracker recommends, and are essentially the same as the Shelby specs, except they recommend +2.5 caster, as opposed to +2. I'm getting ready to get mine realigned with these same specs. Opentracker knows they're stuff, and these are the specs most everyone on here will recommend to you as well.

Also, make sure you get those shock towers looked at. If they are indeed cracked, which is VERY common on these cars, no alignment is going to fix your problems. Just peek your head under the fender and look at the shock towers around where the upper control arm is attached. If you see any cracks or spots where they have been welded in an attempt to repair them, you've got bigger issues.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
20,998 Posts
How about a few more specifics about the car? It's very easy to check toe. I just set mine. I have two pieces of aluminum angle from a net work rack. You could use just about anything such as two blocks of wood. I placed one on each side of the tire right on the middle seam. I used a folding wooden rule to measure the distance between the center line of the tires, front and back. I set it for 1/8" toe in. If you need more toe in, looking from behind the front wheels, rotate the left side down, right side up, or visa versa to reduce toe. One full turn on each side makes about 1" difference in toe! Go in 1/4 of a turn. After each adjustment, roll the car back a few feet then forward to check. To center the steering wheel turn the adjusting sleeves in the same direction, either both up or both down. Recheck toe.

Don't forget alignment settings were meant for bias tires, not radials and these cars didn't use a lot of caster to begin with. Radial tire contact patch is farther back, reducing caster as I've been told by guys who really know what they are doing. You probably need a lot more caster.

F15 who's a member had a slick way of checking camber. Measure the distance between upper and lower balljoints, cut a piece of tubing, such as electrical EMT just slightly shorter and cut a notch on each end to fit over the ball joint stud and slip the tubing between the ball joints and now you can simply measure caster with an angle finder. Be sure to be on level ground but I guess if you measured the angle or slope of the floor you could subtract from what you measured to find the real caster.

And last, these are old cars!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
895 Posts
Lack of sufficient toe in will cause a car to wander. Toe out will create a situation where the car turns easily, which sounds like your description of "spasmotically wandering".
I agree with the excessive toe-out. I can't tell from the pictures, improper toe will cause the effected edges to feather or cup. It won't look like proper tire wear even for that small bit of the tread. Excess camber will cause the effected edge to be worn more than the rest of the tire, but it will look cleaner. The excess toe is dragging the tire against the pavement, thats why it will look roughed up.

I would guess the P.O. replaced the outer tie rods due to shot ball joints and didn't align the vehicle/front toe properly.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
187 Posts
Discussion Starter #20
1 - 20 of 27 Posts
Top