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Wanted, Kelsey/Hayes disc brake porn

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Does anyone have any info on 19641/2 -Jan 65 Mustang kelsey/Hanes disk brake option:
Build numbers? Hardware? Part numbers? Did all K codes have them? I’m pretty sure all the Shelbys had them assuming there were differences within the models? like color? with different rims? …basically, anything with info on this subject?
I have read some stuff but hard to get info.
I believe I have most all the parts as I just detailed mine on my C Code Nov 1964 Mustang.
I know I am missing my actual original K/H calipers and distribution block. Otherwise, I have all the original hardware with the hieroglyphics and such…just trying to find the exact missing parts for my restoration. Any feedback is appreciated.
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Chock would be your go to guy in this I would think.
 

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Here are some photos of my 65-66 calipers I just installed. Colors/finishes are not concours. I believe the caliper bodies originally were natural cast iron. Will defer to the concours folks' opinion, but I am old enough to remember...and forget. Also see no evidence of paint on some unmolested calipers. The cross-over tubes were also natural (fittings may have been that golden iridescent finish). Generally, the 64.5-66 calipers have a separate removeable ring (golden iridescent finish) around the piston opening for the dust cover retention. The 67 up have a ring machined into this location. It is important to get the right rebuild kit for the vintage of the caliper for this reason. Another difference is the pad retainers. Notice the full plate covering mine. Two flat springs near the center of the plate retain the pads in position. Tabs clip through the plate to retain the springs. The 67 up have two little curly springs at top and bottom of same opening instead of the full plate. They are retained by the same bolts used for the plate. Another difference is the size of the flexible brake hose fitting. 64.5-66 has a 3/8th inlet, 67 up have a 7/16th from my reading. A final difference I have heard about is the depth of the pistons. Both will work on the early Mustangs, but the flexible hoses tips will have to match the caliper vintage. I have heard of people who discovered they have one vintage on one wheel and the other on the other. Both will bolt right on & function normally even if differing vintage. I've got a set of 67 up in the garage I will take some shots of tomorrow and update.
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More really dirty brake porn. These are the later design K-H calipers I mentioned earlier. Note the pad retainer difference. The dust boot goes into a groove in the piston bore instead of an external retention ring.

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65 Mustang Caspian blue coup, disc brakes, equaloc rear, power steering, 289 auto >100k born Nov 64
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
When I got rid of the rust and detailed my parts they all were unique in the fact that they almost looked the color of stainless steel. A very nice light gray. This included the Rockford bolts in the shield/K/H disc mount attachment.Even my old aftermarket brakes did the same! No Chinese metal here.
So one would think that the sane color ie. High temp paint would be fine? I have the original wire spoked hubcaps, so I guess black is not necessary?
 

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65 Mustang Caspian blue coup, disc brakes, equaloc rear, power steering, 289 auto >100k born Nov 64
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·

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Someone else shared my thread, but this year I restored three pairs of OEM Kelsey Hayes front disc brakes complete with calipers, pad retaining clips, caliper brackets, dust shields, and spindles. Attaching photographs of casting numbers and soem stamping numbers that I have come across. OEM caliper pistons will have K/H stamped on the inside. The original boots will even say Kelsey Hayes. OEM calipers have small and unique stampings on the backside. I have been able to decode or find any information associated with the numbers.

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65 Mustang Caspian blue coup, disc brakes, equaloc rear, power steering, 289 auto >100k born Nov 64
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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Here are some photos of my 65-66 calipers I just installed. Colors/finishes are not concours. I believe the caliper bodies originally were natural cast iron. Will defer to the concours folks' opinion, but I am old enough to remember...and forget. Also see no evidence of paint on some unmolested calipers. The cross-over tubes were also natural (fittings may have been that golden iridescent finish). Generally, the 64.5-66 calipers have a separate removeable ring (golden iridescent finish) around the piston opening for the dust cover retention. The 67 up have a ring machined into this location. It is important to get the right rebuild kit for the vintage of the caliper for this reason. Another difference is the pad retainers. Notice the full plate covering mine. Two flat springs near the center of the plate retain the pads in position. Tabs clip through the plate to retain the springs. The 67 up have two little curly springs at top and bottom of same opening instead of the full plate. They are retained by the same bolts used for the plate. Another difference is the size of the flexible brake hose fitting. 64.5-66 has a 3/8th inlet, 67 up have a 7/16th from my reading. A final difference I have heard about is the depth of the pistons. Both will work on the early Mustangs, but the flexible hoses tips will have to match the caliper vintage. I have heard of people who discovered they have one vintage on one wheel and the other on the other. Both will bolt right on & function normally even if differing vintage. I've got a set of 67 up in the garage I will take some shots of tomorrow and update. View attachment 868164 View attachment 868165 View attachment 868166
Thanks for your thoughtful response. I like your work. I have been past the rebuilding “learning curve”. Learned most of that the hard way. I rebuilt my discs I installed a long time ago. Lost money on wrong parts and replacing the parts I jacked up, to actually ordering the parts and receiving the wrong ones. Matter of fact, thats what brought this on. Frustrating but fascinating, I’m on a mission to get this car right. While rebuilding my entire brake system, I found hieroglyphics on the spindles (and a lot of things with a “D” marked on them.”, throughout the entire vehicle! Really cool since my first name starts with a “D”. Who woulf gave thought that Ford built this mustang with me in mind😂.
Then I went into the “oh **** mode” here goes another rabbit hole and more $ and work. I found the original paint marks on my spindles. So I tore fown both sides and refurbished the dust covers and replaced all the lines with stainless. Rebuilt the proportioning valve, installed new lines. Thought they were the right ones, but not for K/Hs. I still have my originals but they no longer meet DOT safety regs. They are “single crimp”. Not the double crimp required. I believe they are concours, for drums or Ford’s disc brakes (67)?
I also realized that the bolts that hold the dust cover to the spindle, were different than the ones I saw in my research. So are mine correct? Or did various plants use different bolt suppliers, Etc? Currently and until I learn more, I am of the opinion, not too many experts in these brakes, thus my forum question. I am also of the opinion, outside of Shelby’s and Ks, this option is rare. The original owner said that too me decades ago. I didn’t pay attention. Who cared about brakes back then? All I cared about was making this car fast!
There has got to be someone besides us restorers, that knows more on the “concours” side of the house, when it comes to part numbers and mustangs that had this option?
You brought up the difference in sizes between 65 and 67 and the rubber boots. I knew that, but how many others don’t? Here’s something I can’t find. What are the exact concours bolts that connect the dust shields to the spindle? Did they very per plant, Etc. I read somewhere that someone identified a set of these discs by their numbers? This is important to me as I am noticing that original and even repos are becoming scarce and I can tell what I’m looking at but can’t tell which is period correct, etc.
 

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65 Mustang Caspian blue coup, disc brakes, equaloc rear, power steering, 289 auto >100k born Nov 64
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Originally the calipers were bare, but I decide to powder coat mine so they look new on my drivers for a long time. I also powder coated the caliper retainer clips, brackets, dust shields, and spindles. I upgraded to braided hoses.

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Cool and thank you. I’m wondering how one determines what model/year did they come from?
Something I found with my 64 was Rockford bolts and the original factory colors on the spindle
 

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Cool and thank you. I’m wondering how one determines what model/year did they come from?
Something I found with my 64 was Rockford bolts and the original factory colors on the spindle
I think these casting numbers on the underside of the caliper would possibly identify something like manufacture date and factory. Most mild corrosion would probably render the stamping illegible, but at the same time, I bet there is little or no information out there to decipher any of it.

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
I think these casting numbers on the underside of the caliper would possibly identify something like manufacture date and factory. Most mild corrosion would probably render the stamping illegible, but at the same time, I bet there is little or no information out there to decipher any of it.

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Thank you for your response. I agree with you entirely. Two questions I think you answered. 1) frigging numbers! This is a step in the right direction. And the second question has been burning in my mind ever since I went down this rabbit hole. I would think that someone in that “Shelby” crowd would know the answers to at least one question? Matter of fact, seems like the “k” code crowd would know as well? I thinking these folks drive their cars, so they will eventually break down and need repair? This is a system (brakes), that take an enormous amount of use, I would think, anyone who had one of those badass rides (65/66), would know every inch of those mustangs. Considering we have had 58 years of these cars? Which leads me to the concours judges at the MCA events? Hell, they see these cars at every event? Then again, maybe their knowledge is just visual identification only?
And lastly, this could have been common knowledge a few decades ago and now we are challenged because that knowledge goes away when someone passes away?
I still am sticking to my premise that this system was a unique system and therefore, a rare option with a mustang unlike the aforementioned Shelby’s and K Codes. Which brings up another question. What about the GTs of 65/66, in terms of this option? I have seen K codes and GTs without the K/H option. I could be mistaken?
And I’m betting your right about the codes? So how to decipher the codes is the real question. Maybe the answer will come from someone eventually? Hopefully sooner than later! I hate buying parts that aren’t right, especially at todays prices. I have noticed that even period correct radiators/carbs and my hubcaps, are getting real expensive, when they were abundant.
 

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I think it all comes down to how detailed you want to be. If you have OEM calipers, caliper brackets, dust shields, caliper retainers, that have their correct numbers for 65-66, then I think you are good to go. Brake pads, pistons, boots, and hoses are all, "wear parts" in my book, and are expected to wear out or be replaced on a 50 year old car. I don't think anyone is going to have the info that we are both looking for. The information is probably lost and gone forever. I invest primarily in 65-66 GT cars, thus why I have so many Kelsey Hayes disc brakes. It is my understanding that all 65-66 GTs came with disc brakes. However, correct me if I am wrong, but a K code without the GT package, would be built with drums unless discs were ordered as a separate option. I have a C code 65 convertible, and since it came with all the correct Kelsey Hayes hardware down to OEM bolts, looks like it was ordered from the factory with disc brakes. However, there is really no way of knowing without a build sheet or dealer invoice since we are pre 67 Marti reports. What surprises me, is that these first generation disc brakes are really not much different than new disc brakes produced today. Yeah, 11" rotors may seems mini by today standards, but these old brakes still hold their own.
 
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