Vintage Mustang Forums banner

1 - 7 of 7 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,029 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Anyone using these heads? I am planning to purchase bare Windsor Jr. (iron) machined for 7/16" studs for the 5.0L. Posts from the previous VMF indicated these heads are the best value for the money. On the other hand, Windsor Jr. received mixed reviews (quality of workmanship, et. al) at Ford Muscle. They're good people at Ford Muscle and their posts are informative. I'm interested in reading more opinions before making a major purchase.

"What we have here is--failure to communicate."

'67 GTA (clone) coupe soon to be 5.0L w/Edelbrock 1406
 
G

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
No, I am not using them. I am just curious. If you are thinking of iron heads have you looked at the gt40p heads? I keep hearing nothing but good things about these heads. They are pretty reasonable priced and flow well. I hope to get a set of these this year. You do need special headers for them though.

Here is an article on them http://www.geocities.com/motorcitymustang/gt40p.html



TJ - Highland Village, TX (DFW area)

66 coupe 302 2v c4 -daily driver
94 GT vert -SWMBO's
93 Aerostar - hauling stuff
50 Mercury Pickup - waiting to be restored, stored back home
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,029 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Initially, I considered GT40P heads but decided not to purchase. For whatever reason or due to editor bias, GT40P heads are not featured articles in most 5.0 magazines. Are these heads a dirty little secret in the 5.0 world? Who knows?

As your post indicated, special headers are required. I called CCM for several months inquiring about these special headers. Their response was, 'Two more weeks.' Those two weeks turned into six months. I will be more confident when GT40P headers designed for classic Mustangs are produced by other manufacturers.

"What we have here is--failure to communicate."

'67 GTA (clone) coupe soon to be 5.0L w/Edelbrock 1406
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,667 Posts
I have a set of ported iron Windsor Jr heads on my motor. I would beat them into a few hundred pieces and send them special delivery back to World Products today if I could afford to.

Unfortunately, I bought the Windsor Jr's long before Fordmuscle's article was published. I did my own research, talked to people that were supposedly running those same heads, read tech articles on some rods that were running them at the race track and got nothing but good feedback. I wish I had found somebody like me to talk to before I bought them. My old home ported early 302 heads performed as well if not better than the Windsor Jr's I'm running now. Unfortunately, my own 65 mustang fastback "dyno" was an expensive place to discover this.

The cast iron Windsors and Jr's come with iron valve guides which is basically just the cast iron of the heads. My cam and many other higher than stock lift cams call for bronze guides. After installing bronze guides they have to regrind the seats. The valve springs these heads come with are for crap so they generally have to be replaced. I don't know about the valves but considering the valve springs I guess I wouldn't take my chances with their valves either. The iron heads also don't come with hardened valve seats. They just flame harden(plasma?) the cast iron of the exhaust seat. All this adds up to these heads not being much of a bargain after you're done.

After my heads were finished at the machine shop I went about installing them. Much to my dismay I found 4 little punched in holes in the cast iron where the exhaust header bolt threads were tapped into the heads. The holes were little cracked, chipped in places where the tap had gotten too close to the exhaust port and actually started to punch through. It looked to me like they just got the casting too thin in that one area and tapping the exhaust header threads was enough to bust it through. World Products wouldn't replace the head. They said just JB Weld it.

I noticed that the head with the cracks was a different version than the other so I called back and inquired on this. Apparently, WP has gone through a few version changes on these heads. I was told that even my newer head had been re-revised. However, the retailers out there are still selling old stuff that probably should be ground up because of engineering flaws and manufacturing defects(my interpretation of the facts). Perish the thought that World Products would ever recall this crap and ship out the newer versions.

The threads for the screw in studs are tapped all the way through into the intake runners. They claim this is because the intake runners are so big(yeah right). I used a normal teflon thread sealer on mine like WP's instructions said and all the screw in studs started to come out of the heads. Fortunately, I discovered this while just idling my motor when one of my rocker arms actually just FELL OFF. I wound up having to loctite the screw in studs to keep them from wallowing loose and falling out of the heads. On calling WP back they said I should have used loctite to begin with. Ok I asked, why didn't their own installation instructions include this little gem of information? No response.

WP's head installation instructions say that you have to use copper wire ring head gaskets instead of the steel wire ones. Otherwise the heads could crack. I asked about this and never got a good answer as to why their heads would crack when stock heads everywhere are running the steel wire ring gaskets. Apparently, these heads are so delicate and prone to cracking that you have to use copper ring head gaskets on them which are the same gaskets that the softer aluminum heads require. Well thats my interpretation of the facts.

I run tri-y headers. WP told me they would not fit and referred me to some company that made headers (expensive) for their heads. I decided to get hard headed and try my tri-y's anyway. I had to make one small clearance on the flange for my spark plug socket and a couple of small intentations on a couple of tubes to clear my plug wire boots. Thats all there was to it. Obviously they didn't know what they were talking about. You can even see the headers set up on my motor on my web page.

I haven't decided for sure which heads I will get next time. I may resurrect my 1970 302's and just go back to running them. My problem is I'm running a 289 that needs high compression and most of the aftermarket heads have way too big combustion chambers. I don't really want to go to pop up pistons just to make a set of heads work. If I do that I'll get the Trick Flows and their custom pistons to match.





You can see my 65 fastback at: http://hottarod.stangnet.com/
http://members.aol.com/macstang/Gifs/macstang3.jpg
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
20,861 Posts
I bought GT40P's. Last year Hot Rod build a 351W, with GT40P heads, they made more power and torque through out the whole rpm range than a pair of Dart Sr. heads! The GT40P's were from Cenrtal Coast Mustang a
nd only really had a good valve job and s.s. valves.

Plus you know the GT40P heads have OEM quality. You'll need MAC or Central Coast Mustang headers. I paid $480.00 for a pair of complete GT40P heads.

Tom
You can do anything you want to......ONCE!
aka "my 66 coupe"
http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1575517&a=11977890&p=44194856.jpg

Hale Boppe comet shot off my roof. See you can use 100 iso at night with no flash!
 
G

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
Every pair of World Products heads I've seen out of the box have had poor machine work leaving flashing in ports and holes. I don't recommend them.
 
G

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
I have started to look at heads for my 302 and talked with a major guru. He sold me on the edelbrock performer rpm series. His take on the GT40 was that it was built for 3 things, 1) create power, 2) work with emissions and 3) be gas efficient. Once you try to meet all of these goals and not just one of them you sacrifice some of all the parts to reach your goal; in the end power suffers. If you plan to put this motor in your '67 look for something that does not consider emissions. Hope this helps.
 
1 - 7 of 7 Posts
Top