351C questions

mustang2plus267 · Dec 1, 2002

I have the chance to pick up a rebuilt 351C with 4 barrel heads for cheap. I know all about 260s through 351Ws, but 351Cs are new animals to me.

Can some of you guys with expereince with the 351Cs tell me about the pros/cons of this engine for street use? Is the 4V or 2V better? How should it fit in a 67 engine bay? The 351C is a 4 bolt main block right? What cfm carb would your suggest? What kind of horses can I epect to make with a Weiand or Edelbrock intake and matching carb?

I've done a search but haven't found too many answers. Hopefully you guys can help. Thanks!

-Aaron

mustang2plus267 · Dec 1, 2002

1 more question. I've got a Toploader that was formerly mated to a 289. Do I need a different input shaft or bellhousing?

Johns72topless · Dec 1, 2002

The toploader will bolt right up to the 351c. But, the 4v heads are not the best for the street. They are high reving, high horsepower, less torque type heads. Not that it will be slouch, but 2v heads are considered the 'street' heads. Not sure about the fit in a 67.
JH

sharkmouth · Dec 1, 2002

There are actually a lot of posts about clevelands here.

I'm partial to 2V heads....the 4V heads have substantial velocity probs at street speeds....if I really wanted better flow than 2V, I'd spring for a set of yates heads.

Most clevelands are 2 bolt main, and most experts say the 4 bolt is rarely necessary.

The cleveland has the 6 bolt small block bellhousing pattern.

As for horsepower, in my not-so-humble opinion, the 2V heads are the best factory small block heads ever made (of any brand).....they'll support 1Hp/ci easy.

jahsboy65 · Dec 2, 2002

A buddy had a 351C in his 67 vert. Unfortunately, he sold it a couple years ago, so all I can tell you is that it CAN be done. Course most anything CAN be done. There's a nut around here with a 460 in his Ranger!

The Cleveland was a MOTOR, though. Didn't sound at all like a 289. People knew it was something special.

mustang2plus267 · Dec 2, 2002

Thanks for the replies everyone. So is it fair to say that a good rule of thumb would be 2V for street/strip, 4V for open racing?

Sounds like the 2V is probably better for my purposes than the 4V huh? Yeah, I'm looking for speed off the line. While I don't really plan on racing it, I'd like the ability to destroy any modded ricer (they can be faster than you think!).

sharkmouth · Dec 2, 2002

Any modded ricer?!?!? some of those yoyo's can do 10's and be streetable (for how long is a different matter)

A 2V headed reasonably streetable 351C in a pony can slap around your average late model 5.0 or 80's camaro.

nosaj122081 · Dec 2, 2002

I ran a modified 2V motor around (Lunati Bracket Master cam, Edelbrock intake, long tubes) with an auto and an 11' converter. It was fun, but not FAST (maybe high 13's). For a car that doesn't see any action above 4k RPM, I'd go with them again. But the new motor I'm setting up is getting closed chamber 4V heads; its going to have a big cam, high redline, and I want it to be FAST. Plus I got sick of the poor 2V parts selection in comparsion to whats available for 4V heads.

2V heads are worthless; I'm not even going to bother trying to sell mine and they've had some upgrades done to them. If you can GET a 4V and WANT 2V heads, buy the 4V, sell the heads for a couple hundred, and then pick up a set of 2Vs for 20 bucks.

I'd either run the Performer (I did) or the Weiand with the plenum divider in it, dependant on if you want stump pulling torque or want it to pull harder up top, on a 2V headed motor... Those 2 are your primary choices. I'm going to use the Edelbrock Torker on my 4V's.

Should fit just fine, they put FE's in those cars /forums/images/icons/smile.gif.

You could probably make a solid 250 RWHP using 2V heads and have it REAL streetable with plenty of torque, but I'd say thats about tops without forcing it. If you run a 4 speed, the 4V heads aren't as bad as lots of people think, and can make SERIOUS horsepower at the cost of sub-3000 RPM performance (I'm not a big advocate of desktop dynos, but my old 2V motor was said by DD to make 350ish HP at 5.5 kRPM, and my new 4V buildup is supposedly going to make 530 HP at 6500)

mustang2plus267 · Dec 2, 2002

I should have said any ricer I'm likely to encounter! I know there are 10 second Civics but not too many kids can afford $8,000 4-cyl heads /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

Wow, this is some awesome info guys. Can't thank you enough. Appropriately, it gets more interesting...

I now have my choice of either a 2V or a 4V 351C. Again, I'm not going for absurd hp but I really want to smoke tires at the stoplights and for the heck of it, I might even bring it to the strip once in a while. My goal is streetability with balls /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

mustang2plus267 · Dec 2, 2002

Oops, another forgot - the 2V I have a chance to buy is a 4-bolt main.

Guest · Dec 2, 2002

Go 4V heads. I don't race my car, but lets face it, do we ever race below 2500 rpm on the street or strip? I don't think so. The 4V Cleveland is very streetable and pulls like crazy through 6,000 rpm. This is the motor and the heads you want for street fun and driveability.

sharkmouth · Dec 2, 2002

2V heads are worthless?!?!?! LMMFAO!!!!

Yates heads have ports that are SMALLER than factory 4V heads AND the porters FILL the ports even further with epoxy.....and those heads are used EXTENSIVELY in various racing classes.

nosaj122081 · Dec 2, 2002

They are worthless.. They hold zero value... I've seen them on for ridiculously low prices (ie, 5 bucks each or something). Like I said, I'm not even gonna bother listing mine and they have screw in studs, guideplates, and hardened seats, because they still would pull zero cash, even though I'll never use them again. Aussies or 4Vs need only apply for my motors.

CantedValve · Dec 2, 2002

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr>

As for horsepower, in my not-so-humble opinion, the 2V heads are the best factory small block heads ever made (of any brand).....they'll support 1Hp/ci easy.

<hr></blockquote>

Gosh.... I dont know how to respond to that... other than to cite your obvious mental instability and ask that people refrain from giving your posts any weight.

mustang2plus267 · Dec 2, 2002

Oh boy, now I'm getting confused /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

From what I've found on the internet, the 2Vs are prefered for street applications and tend to have a torque peak at around 3800rpm. Sounds good to me. Unless somebody wants to talk me out of 2Vs, I think that's the route I'm going.

sidewinder · Dec 2, 2002

I'm not a cleveland expert,but have owned alot of them. I've seen where the 2v is a better street head and race head. I've ran both and in stock configuration the 4v stomps them. The 2v's that people unknownly refer to are highly modified. The 2v head is a great head and the balance between intake and exhaust is about perfect.As for the 4v even on the street they flat out rock and have ran in the sevens"not my car" on the strip" something I have yet to see a 2v do". As far as I'm concerned 500 lbs of torque @ 1000 rpm don't really help anyway, as previously posted your 4500-6000 anyway.

Mtrain · Dec 2, 2002

Listen, I think I have some really good advise for you. Get the 4bbl motor with the 4bbl heads, pull the heads and check to see if they are the quench chamber, if they are you might want to hold onto them. If not sell them and order some of the Aussie 2bbl heads. The aussie heads are quench chamber and are less will give you more compression and are less likley to detonate because of the quench chamber design actually extinguishes the flame front as it spreads across the chamber. The horsepower potential is better for the 4bbl heads due to their sheer size, the problem is getting enough airflow at low rpms to make them breath, but I have used nitrous oxide to get me off the line until the 4bbl heads start to make power.
Just my .02

sharkmouth · Dec 2, 2002

So as you can see, there are many folks who passionately support their beliefs concerning cleveland setups....sorry our strong debate might leave you undecided.....

You might consider looking at this forum about clevelands..

http://www.network54.com/Hide/Forum/119419

And best of luck with your car!!

CantedValve · Dec 2, 2002

Dont misread me... they make good power.... but to call them the best heads ever made... sheesh.

If I had to rank the STOCK style heads, Aussies and 4V closed are tied (maybe 4V has a slight edge), but for different reasons (Aussies provide MASSIVE street power, 4V closed give you monster HP, but in a higher band). 2V opens are third, and then the 4V opens are last. As always, you can make any of them work with enough $$$ and time.

To get back on topic, you can realistically make 350HP with 2V heads (with minimal effort)... and a LOT more with 4V heads (with no effort). If you plan to race, 4V, a close ratio TL, and 3.89 gears will make you SCREAM. If you want street, you can still go 4V, but make SURE you have the rest of the car to do it. Gears and convertor (if AT) are gonna be a must. 4V heads can be modified to increase low end w/o sacrificing high-end, but it takes some know-how.

I wouldnt even bother with a Performer. An Xcellerator (weiand) is gonna give you as much low end, better peak, and more RPMs regardless of what heads you use.

I am doing an Aussie head engine, but recently I have had serious thought about using these 4V closed heads I have. It would take a rear gear swap (which will probably happen regardless), but I think high revs are starting to grow on me.

wantamach1 · Dec 2, 2002

Interesting thread.

I bought a 70 mach, 351c 2v not long ago. As I've learned more about these cars, I thought I should have shopped around for an M code. Now I'm not so sure.

I'm like the origional poster. Not looking to be a street predator, but don't want to be embarased either.

What exactly is meant by "streetable"??

Randy

351C questions

mustang2plus267

mustang2plus267

Johns72topless

sharkmouth

jahsboy65

mustang2plus267

sharkmouth

nosaj122081

mustang2plus267

mustang2plus267

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sharkmouth

nosaj122081

CantedValve

mustang2plus267

sidewinder

Mtrain

sharkmouth

CantedValve

wantamach1

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