Delo or Rotella 15w40 both have enough zinc and phosphorous even in the reformulated versions. Valvoline VR1 also has the recommended amounts.
Here is a really long thread from a guy who sends virgin oil samples to independent labs and posts his results. There many more than what I listed above.
Link

 

I'm going with Mobil1 15w50 and Mobil1 filter. The level of zinc is supposed to be pretty good with that exact oil. Other posters on here have used it. I'll have to see how my car handles it. Other than that, your options are limited.

 

I'm going with Mobil1 15w50 and Mobil1 filter. The level of zinc is supposed to be pretty good with that exact oil. Other posters on here have used it. I'll have to see how my car handles it. Other than that, your options are limited.

that is what I'm using also. If you want use a lighter wt. oil, I'd still recommend Mobil 1 , but add enough of this product to get the zddp up to 1200 ppm:

http://www.cam-shield.com/index.html

Z. Ray

 

I'm going with Mobil1 15w50 and Mobil1 filter. The level of zinc is supposed to be pretty good with that exact oil. Other posters on here have used it. I'll have to see how my car handles it. Other than that, your options are limited.

that is what I'm using also. If you want use a lighter wt. oil, I'd still recommend Mobil 1 , but add enough of this product to get the zddp up to 1200 ppm:

http://www.cam-shield.com/index.html

Z. Ray

Affirmative, I'm already setting aside some for my cold weather oil change. I'll probably go with a lighter mobil1 and some of the cam shield.

 

I'm going with Mobil1 15w50 and Mobil1 filter. The level of zinc is supposed to be pretty good with that exact oil. Other posters on here have used it. I'll have to see how my car handles it. Other than that, your options are limited.

that is what I'm using also. If you want use a lighter wt. oil, I'd still recommend Mobil 1 , but add enough of this product to get the zddp up to 1200 ppm:

http://www.cam-shield.com/index.html

Z. Ray

Affirmative, I'm already setting aside some for my cold weather oil change. I'll probably go with a lighter mobil1 and some of the cam shield.

most of the Mobil 1 oils have 800 ppm of zddp with the exception being the 0w-40 which has 1000 ppm. The cam shield instructions gives all the details on how much of it to use to arrive at a desired zddp level.


Z.

 

Roush Racing oil (made by Valvoline) has a new synthetic oil available in lighter weights with the correct amount of ZDDP. Check roushoil.com for your distributer.
Our local (San Jose CA) Goodies Speed Shop now
has it.
(Just bought a case of VR-1 10W-30, otherwise i'd try it).

 

Roush Racing oil (made by Valvoline) has a new synthetic oil available in lighter weights with the correct amount of ZDDP.
Our local (San Jose CA) Goodies Speed Shop now
has it.
(Just bought a case of VR-1 10W-30, otherwise i'd try it).

know of any internet sources for the Roush Oil ?

Z. Ray

 

1971 Mach1 said:
"(Just bought a case of VR-1 10W-30, otherwise i'd try it)."

Does the Valvoline VR-1 10W30 have the correct amount of "stuff" (ZDDP) in it and is it syn or dino oil? I want to do the first oil change with a mineral oil before going to full synthetic. Added the EOS to the initial oil, using what remained of the can after coating the cam, lifters, bearings etc when putting the engine together.

 

VR1 is dino oil and, yes, it does have the correct amount of zddp.

 

Valvoline 10W- 30 and Cam-Shield.(For me)

 

Brad Penn 30 weight "break in" oil for the new engine. Then Brad Penn 10w-30 after break in. Confirmed with the cam manufacturer that nothing else is needed.

 

I couldn't get mobile 1 where i live, so i ended up with royal purple Engine break in oil 10W-30.

On the bottle it claims this is the oil to use for flat tappet engines.

This is the first oil change since my engine rebuild last year. I have no idea what oil my engine builder used. But, since i put in the royal purple the engine is quieter sounding.


"Royal Purple Break-in Oil

Engine builders have grown increasingly concerned that many modern motor oils do not provide adequate wear protection for new engines, particularly those using flat-tappet cams. Royal Purple has addressed this issue by developing a new engine break-in oil."

 

Any Heavy Duty Engine Oil (HDEO) will have more than enough ZDDP for flat tappet engines. It is actually the phosphorus in the additive that provides the anti-wear protection. The older CI-4/SL versions have a bit more than the CJ-4/SM oils but, since the specification is performance-based and backwards compatible, the latest oils will work fine, especially in engines that are in stock or near-stock condition. HDEOs have better cleanliness additives than racing oils (like VR-1) so they can easily run longer than 3000 miles and keep your engine cleaner.

There is no need to use a 40-weight oil (10W-40, 15W-40, etc) in an good-running engine that originally called for a 30-weight oil (30, 10W-30, etc). If you want to stick with a dino-oil, Shell Rotella T 10W-30 (CI-4/SL) and Brad Penn HDEO 10W-30 (CJ-4/SM) are readily available. Synthetic 30-weight HDEOs are available too but, because they flow so well in cold temperatures by their nature, are available as 0W-30 and 5W-30.

ACCCC Engine Oil Article

 

[quote='70 StangMan]Valvoline 10W- 30 and Cam-Shield.(For me)[/quote]

I hear it's bad to have too much ZDDP too. It can cause pitting. Valvoline VR-1 10W-30 already has 1200ppm (supposedly the correct amount).
Disreguard if you're using regular Valvoline (not VR-1).

Z-Ray,
For Roush Racing oil, check for distributors at roushoil.com
Looks like Roush 10W-40 is the only one with 1200ppm ZDDP.

 

Any Heavy Duty Engine Oil (HDEO) will have more than enough ZDDP for flat tappet engines. It is actually the phosphorus in the additive that provides the anti-wear protection. The older CI-4/SL versions have a bit more than the CJ-4/SM oils but, since the specification is performance-based and backwards compatible, the latest oils will work fine, especially in engines that are in stock or near-stock condition. HDEOs have better cleanliness additives than racing oils (like VR-1) so they can easily run longer than 3000 miles and keep your engine cleaner.

There is no need to use a 40-weight oil (10W-40, 15W-40, etc) in an good-running engine that originally called for a 30-weight oil (30, 10W-30, etc). If you want to stick with a dino-oil, Shell Rotella T 10W-30 (CI-4/SL) and Brad Penn HDEO 10W-30 (CJ-4/SM) are readily available. Synthetic 30-weight HDEOs are available too but, because they flow so well in cold temperatures by their nature, are available as 0W-30 and 5W-30.

ACCCC Engine Oil Article

I agree with you about "SOME" racing oils not having detergents. Aparently VR-1 is one that does though. Roush says their synthetic racing oil has detergents too (also made by Valvoline).

I notice you are from Canada, so standards may be different. New oil requirements in the states are not "backwards compatible" for flat tappet engines since they took out alot of the ZDDP in the latest API standard.

 

Would using a 50-weight oil affect the way a car actually runs? Or is this just a wear issue?

 

Would using a 50-weight oil affect the way a car actually runs? Or is this just a wear issue?

I could hear my hydrolic lifters tapping for a LONG time after cold startup with Mobil1 15W-50 even in warmer weather,,, that can't be good.
They're quiet as can be with VR-1 10w-30, that's proof enough for me.

Oil pressure can be higher with the thick oil too, not sure what long term problems that would cause. Probably not a big deal if you're only running a 500mile race, like what 50w oil is designed for.

 

From what I've read, VR-1 does contain some detergents but I also read on their site earlier that VR-1 should be changed at intervals not longer than 3000 miles (but can't seem to find it now). The additives in HDEOs are designed to keep engines clean and minimize wear over much longer distances. In Canada, we use the same API standards for engine oil as you do.

According the Valvoline VR-1 Product Data Sheet, VR-1's additives are designed to protect against high temperature deposits and with an enhanced anti-foam system. My feeling is that most street-driven vehicles will also not be driven hard enough to benefit from racing oil additives. High RPM and high load apparently do not lead to sludge formation, which oil for a street-driven engine should protect against.

BITOG: What causes sludge?

Sludge is "Promoted by mixed driving conditions in which there is stop and go and highway operations."

 

[quote='70 StangMan]Valvoline 10W- 30 and Cam-Shield.(For me)

I hear it's bad to have too much ZDDP too. It can cause pitting. Valvoline VR-1 10W-30 already has 1200ppm (supposedly the correct amount).
Disreguard if you're using regular Valvoline (not VR-1).

Z-Ray,
For Roush Racing oil, check for distributors at roushoil.com
[/quote]


1600 ppm of zddp is the most I've seen listed on any of current oils, and that was on Mobil 1 V-twin oil. Other than that, 1200 seems to be the maximum available zddp w/o adding additives. They do have 1750 ppm of zddp in their racing oil line.

Anyone have the zddp numbers, or web links, with oils other than the Mobil 1 products ?

http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Files/Mobil_1_Product_Guide.pdf

 

[quote='70 StangMan]Valvoline 10W- 30 and Cam-Shield.(For me)

I hear it's bad to have too much ZDDP too. It can cause pitting. Valvoline VR-1 10W-30 already has 1200ppm (supposedly the correct amount).
Disreguard if you're using regular Valvoline (not VR-1).

Z-Ray,
For Roush Racing oil, check for distributors at roushoil.com

1600 ppm of zddp is the most I've seen listed on any of current oils, and that was on Mobil 1 V-twin oil. Other than that, 1200 seems to be the maximum available zddp w/o adding additives. They do have 1750 ppm of zddp in their racing oil line.

Anyone have the zddp numbers, or web links, with oils other than the Mobil 1 products ?

http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Files/Mobil_1_Product_Guide.pdf[/quote]
There is a wealth of info in this thread. Link

 

New oil requirements in the states are not "backwards compatible" for flat tappet engines since they took out alot of the ZDDP in the latest API standard.

API disagrees with you:

• API Engine Oil Service Categories
• Do API CJ-4 oils protect older engines as well as API CI-4 or API CI-4 PLUS oils?

The certifications are performance-based with standardized test procedures. If your engine has an aggressive aftermarket valvetrain, I would say that you would need more protection than what is required by the latest API Starburst oils ( ILSAC GF-4). The Corvair Flat Tappet Article recommends that CI-4/SL HDEOs have all the ZDDP required any flat tappet engine. Esso's Flat Tappet Engine Wear Bulletin suggests that 500 ppm is sufficient for "engines in the field". I'm not sure what Shell Rotella T or Brad Penn HDEO 10W-30 have for phosphorus content but Esso XD-3 Extra 10W-30 (CJ-4/SM) has 1110 ppm of phosphorus compared to VR-1's 1300 ppm.

According to Widman, XD-3 Extra 10W-30 has enough phosphorus to qualify as a good CI-4 oil (1000-1200 ppm). Besides, the previous oil certifications (SJ & SL) were limited to 1000 ppm of phosphorus to meet ILSAC GF-2 & GF-3 (earlier Starburst certifications).

 

Where did you come from, Fraso? It's been 3 years since you registered. lol.

If they find 500 "sufficient." That means that we should use more than that. 1000-1100 works for me.

 

API disagrees with you:

• http://www.api.org/certifications/engineoil/categories/index.cfm
• http://www.apicj-4.org/faqs.html#6

I think the API doesn't want confusion on what oil to use on a late model car with a catalitic converter, if they had 2 standards. So since there's not many cars any more that have flat tappets, they're saying their standard SM is backwards compatible. The older cars will wear out a little sooner but few will notice if their engine lasts 110K instead of 150k. Most sell or junk it before then anyway cause of crappy 1980s transmissions. The important thing is our cat converters are safe.
We hobbyests are a minute minority of total cars out there so we're really on our own on this issue. API is just bowing to EPA regulations.

 

I believe that the API's certification involves a wear test that uses an OEM-style engine. The performance tests for SM oils build on the SJ and SL requirements plus have additional performance and emission requirements. If your engine uses valve springs and camshafts that are similar to production spring-strengths and valve-lifts, any Starburst oil should give it sufficient protection. However, I agree with you that Starburst oils will probably not give enough protection to engines with high lift cams using high strength springs.

My suggestion was to use an HDEO (CJ-4/SM or CI-4/SL) rather than Starburst or racing oils. Even the latest CJ-4 HDEOs have more than enough phosphorus to protect older flat tappet valve trains. They also have stronger detergents/dispersants to control sludge better than Starburst or racing oils. The trade-off is that HDEOs don't have friction modifiers which can potentially cost you 1-2% in fuel economy.

The highest levels of ZDDP are generally found in 15W-40 CI-4/SL oils. Esso XD-3 Extra 15W-40 (CI-4+/SL), for example, contains 1370 ppm. This would also work in the older engines but, since 30-weight oils were originally specified, excessive viscosity will cost you a slight amount of power and fuel economy. According to Widman, the best protection for bearings is with using the same hot-viscosity oil as originally specified by the manufacturer.

As far as cost goes, the Shell distributor in Buffalo, NY quoted me US$36.72 for 12 quarts of 10W-30 Rotella T. The local Chevron distributor quoted me US$79.35 for 12 quarts of 0W-30 Delo 400 Synthetic so I think using an HDEO also wouldn't be much more expensive than using VR-1.

ACCCC Engine Oil Article

 

After reading the advice all of you furnished, I used 10W30 VR1. The valve springs are new along with a new cam, lifters, guides and seats. The cam will not experience any abnormal pressure, just wanted to get some break-in miles on things without drama. Thanks for all of the information.