[jkehayias]

I am sure this is up for debate, but how much rust is to much? I have a 66 coupe that I am finally getting to put some time into, and the more I take apart, the more rust I am finding. In some cases, it is a lot worse than I would have ever expected.

When I bought the car, it had just been "restored" by the dealer I purchased it from. However, my idea of a restoration, and their idea differ drastically. Rather than doing my research, I just bought the car, and it has all the symptoms of being a 66 mustang. The cowls are rusted out worse than most pictures I have seen on the internet, which resulted in huge holes in the floors as well as most of the front end sheet metal. The drivers side A piller is only connected by a 1 inch piece of metal that may not really be all that good. I am afraid to tap on it for fear it will crumble. Both drip rails could easily be wiggled off with a pair of pliers, and there are some significant holes in the back pillers behind the quarter windows. This was all hidden when I purchased the car by gobs of bondo and new paint job which immediately began to bubble and chip since the underlying rust problems were not dealt with properly.

At what point is it best to decide to get another body and start over? I can post some pictures of what I am seeing if necessary. I consider myself to fairly handy with tools, and I have done a little welding in the Army, but on 1/4" steal that just had to hold together not look pretty. I feel like I might be in over my head for body work on this specific car, and I don't have any kind of emotional attachment to it other than it is the first mustang I have ever owned and the fact that I have money already invested in it. While not opposed to the idea of paying a shop to do all the body work, I don't see the reward in that, and I can't really afford it.

Right now I am in the process of stripping it down and slowly storing each piece with photos and instructions on how I took it apart in my attic. Once I finish that, my original goal was to have it media blasted and primed so I could see all the area's that need addressing and start working on them one at a time. No real rush on completing this project. I loved working on my cars when I was a teenager and this kind of project has always been my dream, a ground up restoration of a classic mustang.

I am sure I could salvage it with the right tools, time, and money, but is it worth doing?

Jon

 

[Lemondrop]

http://www.cardomain.com/ride/488852

Go read my cardomain site and then decide if your ready to go that far or farther if needed to fix the hull .

 

[Guest]

You say you bought the car from a dealer? Have you considered taking the car back to them and explaining what a pos it is? I understand that lemon laws and such are not applicable to your situation, but covering up that many problems seems like ill intent on the dealers part to me. It may not get you anywhere but I think I would try that first.

 

[jkehayias]

Lemon Drop: If nothing else, I have a great new reference for how to do all my repairs. Thank you for all the hard work and documentation.

NapaGuy: I bought it 3 years ago when I returned from Iraq as a gift to myself. I have considered taking it back there complete and showing them what a real restoration is.

Jon

 

[Marc4d]

Jon, Buy yourself a welder and just go for it!
Thats what i did with my 65 coupe and while im not perfect at it just yet im getting better all the time Welding is kinda fun.
I live with 2 roomates and since welding isnt a spectator type chore i love goingout to the garage turning up the tunes and Bzzzzz! Bzzzz! bzzzz! bzzzz! well you get the point.
Ive replaced my side cowl panels,lower cowl panel,r+rd the uppercowl panel and patched in my inner rocker panels and the only real problem i had was using weld-thru primer which id rather call weld thru splatter primer!
Dont be discouraged and take it one thing at a time as i went straight to the source and replaced my lower cowl panel first and then sourced the info from this fine forum as i went along.
I went to the swapmeet yesterday and bought the full floorpan from dynacorn and that will be my next step.
Just remember one step at a time and eventually youll have a rust free Mustang that youll be happy knowing you did it and have bragging rights that your mustang has a brand new rust free lower cowl too!

 

[dalorzof]

Sure, you can "salvage" anything with enough metal and welding!

Are '66 coupe shells that hard to find? To me it sounds like way more work than its worth, unless its a "special" build.

IMO find a donor body with some metal left and go for it... for all the time, effort, and cost to reapir the issues you note I'd think you'd come out ahead with a good shell... unless you want to really learn how to fix metal! (me, I pay someone to do that part!)

But then I spend hours fixing odd-ball parts, so whatever floats your boat.

Bottom line, have fun with it and do what you want... its a hobby!!!

 

[jkehayias]

I have the front end totally disassembled now, the interior gutted, and the doors and windows out. Based on what I have read and seen on other members rides, I don't seem to have that bad of a car to work with. The majority of my damage is cowl leaking based (floor pans, toe boards, upper firewall rust, and a few other things).

I have tried to be meticulous in tagging and bagging items as they come off the car, and keeping different areas in their own storage containers. All my drivers side stuff is in a bin, all the passenger side another one etc. One question I have is should I be working to save all my fasteners, or could I buy one of the AMK fastener kits and expect that it will have what I need when I go to put the car back together?

I will post pics tonight when I get a moment.

Jon

 

[hotdog]

Go with the AMK kits, you'll not regret it. Start your repairs on the floors and build your skills as you go. The cowl area will be the toughest, however as an alternative to welding, there is that 2 part body glue you can use. I've used it in patching corners on my fathers Chevy PU when I didn't want to much distortion, 4 years and going strong.

It will be a multi-year ride, but hey, when it is done think how much better prepared you'll be on your next purchase!

 

[sfi427]

Just depends on what you consider too much work on your end. Your car isn't that bad. The above advice is great. You will learn a lot and have more pride than ever when you are done. Just remember to take accurate measurments FIRST before cutting. Align the new panels with the old dimensions and weld away.

 

[JohnZ]

RE the question about when to throw away parts that you will replace. My rule of thumb is NEVER throw away anything until it's replacement is on the car and functioning.

Is it worth it? As an "investment" no! As a hobby, priceless. Especially the first time some guy/gal says nice car and you tie him/her down and explain for at least 5 hours all the work you put into the car.

 

[jkehayias]

I opened a CarDomain site and will work to keep my work documented there, so I can look back when I finish and see all I did. I like that LemonDrop could share that. Compared to the responses and pictures on his site, I am beginning to consider myself blessed. What I found with my floor pans is quite interesting and made me laugh.

The new pictures can be seen at:

http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2641349

One question I have about them is on the passenger side cowl, it looks like all three pieces of metal in the corner are missing at least an inch of material. Does this mean I need to look at replacing the firewall, or should I consider just welding in some patches?

My sandblaster should be here by the weekend and I get to play a whole lot more. Is there anyone in the Tampa/St Pete area who could recommend a Welding supply shop? If not I will plan to stop by one of the welding shops and see where they purchase their supplies.

Jon

 

[mach_foster]

That is a heck of a project that you have there. For a coupe it will be cheaper and less work to find a shell that is in good shape. All the sheet metal, welding materials, grinding and cutting wheels and time really add up. But it can be done, I know because I have been there for the past two years.

Keep all your hardware in bags labeled. It will be useful when you start to put the car back together even when using AMK kits. Also, factory assembly manuals are a must. Get them and take time to understand each assembly of the car in detail. Take tons of pictures. I have taken over 2000 photos since the start of my project. I refer to them often and they are an invaluable reference.

 

[68RCodeConv]

IMO it doesn't take much rust to sour me on a car. Especially one as common as a 65-66 coupe.

Anything beyond the usual stuff (cowl, floorpans, bottoms of doors, trunk dropoffs, wheelwells, etc.) I would throw in the towel.

When you start talking about frame rails, roof, torque boxes, trunk floors - forget it.

You are ALWAYS way ahead starting with a better car. The thing that a lot of people forget is that you only have so much enthusiasm when working on an old car. If you use it all up fighting the rust then you will never get the car to anything approaching a finished state. That's why there are so many unfinished projects out there.

Plus you have the satisfaction of knowing that your car has most of its original sheet metal.

 

[Mustangerbob1]

Depends on the car. In Los Angeles, cars were scrapped for a bad windshield wiper, even though it never rains. 10 years ago, I scrapped numerous runnings 6 cyl 65 - 68 coupes for parts to repair more valuable cars (sad, but reality). For example, took a PERFECT 66 coupe, not even a door ding, no rust anywhere, but totally trashed paint and interior (sun baked). Had a 6 cyl 3 speed, and nothing else. I became the donor for a major A code GT fastback rebuild, including door, fenders, and the complete hull of front/rear frame rails, floors, quarters, etc. cut off in one piece and grafted to the underside of the fastback.

Many of the cars were sectioned, with quarters sent to various point in the northeast/Canada to save other cars. Sometimes, I would take a stripped hull, palletize it, and freight the whole thing up North.

There was a large supply of coupes in the $500 and less range, without rust, up to 5 years ago, and can still be found with a little work. I looked at them the way a meat market looks at a steer. Even though my first Mustang was a 65 6 cyl, those cars were just worth more apart than together.

 

[jkehayias]

I have spent the last day pondering what to do, and after discussing it with the wife, we decided to keep this car, and have fun making repairs. It will no doubt be a lot of work, but I bought it as a hobby car, to learn, tinker, and otherwise have a reason to drink a beer, and turn a wrench on something not my daily driver.

I never planned to finish this immediately. In fact when I decided to take it completely apart, I resigned myself to the fact that I probably wouldn't have it back together before my baby starts kindergarden (she turns 1 next month). Perhaps by the time she is driving, and she will have a sweet ride in high school, so I can get another one to play with.

Now I am torn on where to go next. I could put the time in sandblasting the car myself and working on it bit by bit which sounds really messy, but I could always say I did it all, or I could pay to have it blasted professionally and be done with that part, or have it acid dipped. Anyone have experience with either of those in the Tampa area?

My brother in law had a car media blasted in the past and recommmended that, but I have so much rust inside of the body from holes that I am not sure it would get it all. The drivers A pillar is my biggest concern there. I would hate to do all the repair work only to have it have rust up inside the pillar that I missed to come back through in a few years.

It will still be another week before I have all the dash tagged and bagged, so I have time to consider my options. I also don't know how stock I want to keep it over doing some of the safety upgrades in my rebuild. I know that the more stock I keep it the lower my total rebuild budget will be. When it comes time to paint it, I know I won't be keeping the factory color (dark green). I am kinda partial to the wimbeldon white that it was painted when I bought it.

To me the planning has been the most fun, especially since my wife gets involved with it and loves to look at other Mustangs and ask how I could do somethings like others have. It will sure be a great day when I have it on the road for the first time complete.

Jon