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Who are the most respected and experienced Ford engine builder in the US?

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67K views 50 replies 23 participants last post by  ScotiaFE  
5
#1 ·
Looking for some engine builders who are the real deal to build me a 427 engine. I have tossed around the idea of buying a Ford Performance crate engine until i further realized that they are mass produced not even at a Ford Racing facility. I think for the money i can get a better built engine if i can work with a trusted and reliable engine builder who really specializes in Ford engines. Most of the engine shops i have come across rebuild everything and i would like to find a shop that really knows Ford inside and out.

Any links or names you guys can post or PM me?
 
B
#2 ·
By 427 I assume you mean a real 427, an FE big block, not a stroked windsor small block. If this is the case there are a few really good places around.

If you want the best however, there is only one choice and that is Barry Robotnick. He is an FE guru that has won the engine masters challenge build off several times. No one knows FE's better and is better at making big horsepower FE's in my opinion. Be prepared, the best doesn't come cheap.

Here's a link to his shop he owns, Survival Motorsports: Survival Motorsports Home Page
 
#3 ·
My first thought would be Jim Dove for "most respected and experienced". I'm not sure they rebuild anymore but you can ask. They do sell engine "packages". Those packages tend to cost more than most of us are willing to pay for an entire Mustang though.
Dove Manufacturing
 
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J
#4 · (Edited)
Ford FE Engines

For a 427,

There are several guys that are considered top of the line

Barry at Survival Motorsports
Kieth Craft
Gessford
Brent Lykins
...

Dove has a lot of mixed reviews, not sure if he builds engines

If your serious, hang out on the Network54 FE forum and ask a few questions

PS: Barry never won the EMC, but he carries the flag well every time he enters, a lot of the guys follow his exploits in the EMC and root like heck for him.
 
B
#14 ·
Just an fyi on FS.....
1. They use parts from critical component suppliers that I have never trusted in 30 years.....

example.....
November 15, 2012
Cant keep 408w together!! now the crank broke. - Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums
“Can’t keep 408w together!! now the crank broke”
(the) “machine shop I had put the short block together, so I put it together myself this time”
“ i've never had to work on one engine so much”
“Its a 408 kit from FordStrokers with Scat h-beam rod and steel crank”
THE CRANK SHAFT BROKE!!!!! not even running it hard, never lost oil pressure. just broke right after the first main and screwed the block up”
 
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5
#6 ·
guys what are the main performance differences from a SB 427 and the FE? I know the FE were used on GT40 and Cobras of yesteryear

i do know the SB 427 can create some incredible power in a nice reliable package. dont see many guys using FE these days

if i only had more of a budget i would die for a Jon kasse Boss 9
 
#7 ·
55Speed said:
guys what are the main performance differences from a SB 427 and the FE? I know the FE were used on GT40 and Cobras of yesteryear

i do know the SB 427 can create some incredible power in a nice reliable package. dont see many guys using FE these days

if i only had more of a budget i would die for a Jon kasse Boss 9
Click to expand...
Less weight with the 351W and a smaller engine that will fit easier in the early mustangs. Jim at FORDSTROKERS has a great rep also Brian at ADPERFORMANCE and if your around Wa state Dale Green at DG Machine and Britco Race engines.
 
#8 ·
Small block strokers seem to be more prevalent than FE's because they are less expensive to build and take up less room in the engine bay. Personally if I have a choice it will always be FE hands down. I think if you do the same things to both a small block and a big block you will always make more power with the FE simply by virtue of the larger displacement.
I've heard good things about many of the premier engine builders but I only have personal experience with one. Barry at Survival rebuilt my 427 TP into a 468 CI monster with good street manners and sear your eyeballs, set your hair on fire performance. I have nothing but praise for his operation.
Besides, what looks cooler in an engine bay than a twin carbureted FE mill?
 
#13 ·
Mark McKeown??!! Has won several Hot Rod shoot outs. Specializes in Clevelands/ windsor small block fords. Hell, he's even help design an all aluminum cleveland block!!
 
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#15 ·
personally, I really don't see the concern about FR engines...even if they are "mass produced", production runs are limited, the QA of the parts is excellent, I have never heard anyone have any issues regarding machine work and a backed warranty...........
 
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#16 · (Edited)
All you small block guys can't really use that weight saving argument anymore with the readily available aluminum blocks FE's out there now.

Besides, how many naturally aspirated small blocks running on 91 octane pump gas without nitrous are making 700 horsepower? Here's an example of a Survival Motorsports big block doing just such a feat: 505 cube 427 Ford FE 694 horsepower on dyno - YouTube
 
#37 ·
No doubt the FEs are badass, and more capable, but with a price tag the average gear head can't afford. That's why you see the small block being so common.

beechkid said:
You are absolutley right in this consideration, but, cast cranks are a never in my world and in the oem's as well with regards to stroker's.in the late 70's when scat got started, I watched as other did their parts fail, and well, I know they started off in the VW bug world and worked their way into the V8's.....and their is a learning curve, but, cast cranks in a stroker, no way! especially in the world of chinese cast billets............
Click to expand...
Scat CAST crank, and Scat I BEAM rods. The 70s are long gone, and they do more than VW bugs. Progress



 
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#21 ·
To the original poster: If you want a small block based engine, you won't go wrong with any of companies recommended.

However if you want a real 427 built by someone who not only specializes in Ford engines, but specializes in FE Ford big blocks, no one is better than Survival Motorsports in my opinion. To quote directly from their website: "We build more FE Fords each month than most shops do in a year".
 
#22 ·
bigb427 said:
However if you want a real 427 built by someone who not only specializes in Ford engines, but specializes in FE Ford big blocks, no one is better than Survival Motorsports in my opinion. To quote directly from their website: "We build more FE Fords each month than most shops do in a year".
Click to expand...
I knew there was a reason that I ordered my new FE from Survival, hehe.
Joking aside, Barry is very knowledgable and a nice guy.
Be prepared to send him a good chunk of money though, FE's are more expensive than SBF's
 
#24 ·
Either engine can be made to make stupid power with enough aftermarket parts.The FE will cost way more and takes up the entire engine compartment..They do have a certain coolness though.
 
#31 · (Edited)
I think this says it all.....

Engine Stroke Rod Length
427 Windsor Stroker 4.0" 6.25"
427 FE 3.78" 6.49"

Difference in weight between a stock SBF and a FE with aluminum heads, intake and water pump? 70#.
Difference in weight between a stock 351W and the same FE? 30#.
Difference in width between a 351W and an FE? 2". Yep, one inch on either side. Same height. Three inches longer.
 
#33 ·
bartl said:
I think this says it all.....

Engine Stroke Rod Length
427 Windsor Stroker 4.0" 6.25"
427 FE 3.78" 6.49"

Difference in weight between a stock SBF and a FE with aluminum heads, intake and water pump? 70#.
Click to expand...
sorry for my stupidity but i don't get it?

are you trying to show some sort of rod/stroke ratio comparison? i'm also not understanding the stock 351W to modified 427FE weight comparison.

how much for a 427FE block that isn't trash? are they cheap?
 
#34 ·
Aside from the negligible weight difference...even comparing a stock 351W to a stock FE you're only talking about 100#, but the power potential due to the more beneficial rod/stroke ratio is higher. The longer the rod in relation to the stroke, the more dwell time at TDC for the piston to absorb the force of combustion.
 
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#38 ·
What would be a good price on a complete (carb to oil pan) 427 Windsor crate engine? Anyone have a link to someone advertising such a motor for sale?

I've never priced one out, just curious exactly how much one costs.
 
#40 ·
keith craft has some FE based engines and SBF's.

the cheapest FE i could find was a 390 based block at $14k @ 550hp/550tq

they advertise a 408/418W at $10k @550hp/550tq

they advertise a 427/438W at $12k @ 585hp/565tq

the windsor based engines look a bit cheaper on that particular site.
 
5
#41 ·
really good info from all of you guys so far and i appreciate that. I will give Survival a call on Monday for sure.

Now here is something to consider as cool as some of these Cammer and Boss 9 motors are can these be used on a regular basis and for extended periods of drives of 3-5 hours? they are race born engines and never were really destined for the street. I cant find a single youtube video of anyone just cruising in one of these all il find are quick drag strip videos or a video idling in the guys shop all eratic. Go to SEMA and you will see some show cars that will never see a track of street and just install these for bling. Go check out Purevisions Martini Mustang from SEMA.

Another thing i need to consider is weight. i am spending a fortune redoing my entire car to get the best handling i could for spirited driving and i plan to do vintage racing at Limerock and Watkins Glen and i might start autocrossing with the car so i need to keep the weight down over my front end as well. I honestly think for what i want with the car a modern Blown Edelbrock Coyote is the engine of choice but i really do not want to open my hood and see plastic on my classic Mustang i really like to keep things old school to a certain degree and these modular swaps are a nightmare to do i keep hearing.

Other goals are the Hot Rod Power Tour and the Great American Race. I need something bulletproof for any of this use.

oh by the way my shock towers are getting removed so il have room for just about anything.
 
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#47 ·
The Boss 429, 427 SOHC, and any stroked FE are the same as any engine, if they are built properly and have a cooling system that is good they will not overheat.

I owned a Boss 429 and drove it in stop and go traffic during summer heat many times and it never ran hot.

An original bare FE 390, 427, 428 block weighs 195 pounds. The new aluminum FE blocks all weigh right around 120 pounds bare. Add aluminum heads and an aluminum intake and you will have an engine that weighs less than an iron head/iron block small block using an aluminum intake!

Survival Motorsports does many budget builds and they have at least one FE budget build featured in a magazine article. I have not priced one of their budget engines, but if you want an FE stroker crate engine as cheap as possible there is a company called Tuff Dawg Engines that will build a 445/390 for right around $6000 that will put out around 450HP.

Survival Motorsports sells every part you can think of if you want to build your own killer FE. One could save a ton of money going this route.
 
#45 ·
When you call Barry at Survival tell him your goals for the car. If handling will be a priority and you want reduced weight you can opt for an alloy block if funds allow.
 
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