What oil should I use? I only drive a average 2 times a month and not far. I live in North Texas.
I have read I need oil with zinc (should not use additives) for older engines with flat tappets.
When looking I can find Valvoline 20w50 High Zinc.
I would appreciate suggestions and information. Thank you

I use "Valvoline VR1" in my '66 289. I believe that is the same thing you are looking at (Valvoline 20w50 High Zinc). I don't recall the numbers offhand. But it has plenty of zinc for flat tappet cams.

I know plenty of guys that use ZDDP additive. I never heard of any issues with it. But there are more knowledgeable folks in this forum that should be here shortly to weigh in.

 

Thank you I was concerned about the vilosity

i was concerned of the viscosity be ping to high. Thank you

 

+1 for the Valvoline VR1 10w30 or 20w50

 

Same here in our 306. Engine builder told us to run VR1

 

For simplicity's sake, I'd simply run the Valvoline VR-1 10W30. All the Zinc you need, no doubts about it's effectiveness, and not super thick.

Valvoline VR1 Racing SAE 10W-30 High Performance High Zinc Motor Oil 1 QT, Case of 6 (amazon.com)

 

I hope I'm not hi-jacking this thread, but... VR1 comes in both conventional and synthetic. Is there a reason to pick one over the other?

 

That is yet another debate. It's a matter of personal preference.

 

I use Rotella T4 15w40 in one of my old cars. It has higher zinc. Didn’t switch to the synthetic as it doesn’t get many miles really.

 

Rotella T4 is not rated "SN" for gasoline engines. I would look elsewhere.

 

I sent an email to Mobil 1 asking for a good oil for a flat tappet 289. They recommended 0W-40.

 

I’ve used the Mobil 1 15w-50 and the Mobil 1 0w-40 in numerous SB and BB vintage Ford engines for over 2 decades.

Either one will protect your engine against wear and give you confidence to run your engine any damn way you like.

I’ve tried really hard to find measurable bearing wear after using the Mobil 1 oils for tens of thousands of miles. But no luck. Everything still looks new.

Z

 

I bought some Driven oil with zinc. Getting ready to do first oil change soon.

 

In your case just pick an oil with high zinc in it and change it appropriately. The rest is all academic.

VR1 and Mobile 1 both come with high levels of zinc and are popular on this forum.

Viscosity is a rabbit hole subject. But the general consensus is anywhere from 10w-30 to 20w-50 is fine.

Drive and enjoy. Don't over think it.

 

In your case just pic an oil with high zinc in it and change it appropriately. The rest is all academic.

VR1 and Mobile 1 both come with high levels of zinc and are popular on this fourum.

Vescosity is a rabbit hole subject. But the general consensus is anywhere from 10w-30 to 20w-50 is fine.

Drive and enjoy. Don't over think it.

"High zinc" does not determine a good oil. Lucas Hot Rod and Classic Oil is a prime example that is both high zinc & crap.

The thinnest oil that will maintain oil pressure will flow fastest to the far reaches of the engine on startup. Maintaining oil pressure is a function of bearing clearances and temperature.

 

PennGrade 1 is a great oil for older engines that benefit from high ZDDP, and it’s available in lots of different viscosities.

 

Good info!

 

Ok. To clarify the vehicle is a 1977 International Scout II with a gas 345 V8 and it specified IH engine oil no 1. If that’s my recollection. IH equilibrated that to 15-40 diesel motor oil at some point. I’ve been using that since about 1995.
The vehicle is original with about 135k miles.

Retells claims to have a 1200-1500 zinc content.
I knew this would spark discussion.

 

As there are several modern anti-galling and anti-scuffing additives, I agree that zinc and phosphorous are not the only, or even the prime concern. Diesel oils have great scuff and gall additives, but poorer lubrication (plenty of data out there). Automotive oils have better lube and gasoline additives (ash, acid, detergents, foaming, etc). ACEA-rated oils can have both. With the exception of VR1, most of the trusted oils with high reputation have ACEA ratings, that include both automotive and Diesel agents in the same oil for scuffing and galling (flat tappet) issues plus other additives we need. Mobil 1 is only one brand example, and there are many others with an appropriate A/B (gasoline auto/Diesel) rating for our engines, such as ACEA A3/B3 or A3/B4. One Pennzoil A3/B3 brew rated best in every category of applicable testing by a small margin, and A/Bs were all rated excellent.

They are formulated with higher than modern "normal" zinc and P, though less than what the hype says, because they also include other additives specifically to prevent that scuffing and galling we are afraid-of. It's not all about Z and P. Also note, that when approaching ±1700 ppm Z or P, it doesn't work how we think, and is safe for short race only - not for street. Too much of a good thing. A lubrication engineer put me onto the ACEA ratings, and I've had zero issues (wear, galling, lobe or lifter damage, etc) for over 20 years, in every type of engine I've run. I do follow proper break-in procedures. ACEA A/B ratings aren't magic, but a simple indicator of appropriate additives for my engine needs. That's me, lots of data, and just passing the info along. Do your thing.

 

Don’t want to run my questions into the ground.
I drive 100% of the time over 50 degrees and somtimes over a 100 degrees. I understand the zinc level in the VR-1 20w 50 has a zinc level of 1200 to 1400ppm.
The questions I have now are. Is the oil fluid enough at startup? Does it have detergent in it?
As mentioned before I have no idea how old or how many miles on the engine.
I read that you don’t want to clean built up in old engines it may cause leaks.

 

Don’t want to run my questions into the ground.
I drive 100% of the time over 50 degrees and somtimes over a 100 degrees. I understand the zinc level in the VR-1 20w 50 has a zinc level of 1200 to 1400ppm.
The questions I have now are. Is the oil fluid enough at startup? Does it have detergent in it?
As mentioned before I have no idea how old or how many miles on the engine.
I read that you don’t want to clean built up in old engines it may cause leaks.

What Ford said...

Note the word "sustained". If the temperature occasionally exceeds 100*F you're fine, especially with today's oil formulations. VR1 does have a "modern" detergent package.

Oil gets dirty from 3 basic sources. #1 is from deposits left behind in the engine that the detergent package "scrubs". #2 is from dirt entering the engine past the air filter, crankcase breather, etc. Poor air filters allow excess dirt to enter which is captured by the oil. #3 is from "combustion byproducts". Water, soot, carbon, etc., that enters the crankcase during normal operation.

Maintain a proper operating temperature. Excessive coolant temperatures mean excessive OIL temperatures that lead to lubricant breakdown and "coking". LOW coolant temperatures lead to excessive sludge build up. Maintain a regular schedule of oil and oil filter changes. If you live in a desert environment with lots of dust and sand, change air filters and engine oil & filter more frequently.

 

Whatever you use, don’t add STP again, or any zinc additives either.

just find a quality oil that has a good reputation and stick with it.

Mobil 1 0w-40 or 15w-50 and the VR-1 are the two I see mentioned most on the VFM by people who do a lot of driving.

Z

 

STP is great stuff..... for a chain lube. Back when motorcycles had chains and not belts, we used to heat STP on the stove....it gets to the consistency of water, drop the chain in and slosh it around thoroughly, then remove from heat and "let simmer"... lol. At room temperature, the STP is nice a sticky and has soaked into all the chain rollers and pins....

 

I like conventional motor oil myself. I have trusted Valvoline products for years. Definitely would use an oil with zinc in it vs. adding it.

 

This may be a dumb question, but why doesn't anyone run Mobil 1 5w-50?

 

Because is doesn't have zinc. Only Mobil 0w-40 and 15w-50 have zinc to my knowledge.

 

I don't understand what M-B specifications have to do with selecting an appropriate viscosity for a Ford engine that had its OWN manufacturers specifications. Is the M-B specification somehow better than Ford's? Also, with regard to M-B "flat tappet" engines.... when was the last time you say a M-B that wasn't OHC? With plenty of choices available for appropriate lubricant in the recommended viscosities I find it hard to comprehend using something intended for another application... Maybe we should all switch to M-B transmission fluid to replace our Type F???

 

Dude, calm.

Mercedes (and also Porsche) are like the only two current manufacturers who have a current specification for their antique products that they are asking petroleum companies to meet. I like Ford well enough but they could care less what currently marketed oil is good for stuff they built a half century ago. Can't say as I blame them really, they are a business.
However some wackos at Daimler and Porsche are still holding up a spec for products they have not sold in many years. To the delight of collectors of those cars. And if you go to the right automotive seminar a couple of professional engine lubricant engineers might let on that those specifications just happen to be ideal for antique pony cars with flat tappet cams.

The focus here should be on what exactly the oil specification entails and means not who published it. I personally do not give two figs about either manufacturer nor any of their products. One I actually dislike, from a repair standpoint anyway.

 

Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel 5w-40 is rated for both gasoline and diesel engines, it has adequate ZDDP at 1,100-1,200ppm. Lowest price I have found is $28 for a 5 quart jug. Seems like the ticket.

 

According to Mobil's website it's API classified as meeting or exceeding "SN". This means ZDDP is 800 or less.... Do you have a link to the spec?

 

The Mobil 1 I've already mentioned, 15w-50 has 1300 ppm of zinc. Can be had for $23 a gallon.
The Mobil 1 "Turbo Diesel Truck 5W-40" also has 1300 ppm of zinc however they clearly state is is for diesle engine use.
Now there is another Mobil 1 5W-40, but I've never personally seen any. It is called "Formula M" and is listed as being specifically for "gasoline and diesel engines with emissions systems" and the "recommended application" "certain Mercedes-Benz vehicles". It does meet M-B 229.3, so there's that but it would be far from my first choice. It has 1100 PPM of zinc.

 

What is your first choice?

 

Soup for the slurping.....

Times are Changing! | The Petroleum Quality Institute of America

pqia.org

 

I found that site too. Sadly, of all the tests they list, none are of oils we generally discuss here.

From some posts on Bob's the oil guy, M1 0w40 is described thin enough to be a 30w. The KV100 and KV40 numbers bear that out. Thin is good for power and efficiency as long as you maintain pressure.

 

I run Mobil1 5W-20 in both my Hemi's and have since new. One has 141k and the other 137k and neither has had any issues (knock on wood). I'd run it the Mustang as well, if I had .0009" of bearing clearance....